Episode 150 - Jamie Kennard - Variable - A film about skiing the highest peaks in the Catskills and Adirondacks

[00:00:28] The bushwhacks were some of the worst days I've ever had in the mountains, or life really

[00:00:35] Whereas Pansom Mountain is totally opposite, it's a mountain on top of a crater

[00:00:40] I think the weather challenges on this incident were particularly difficult

[00:00:46] It is really the development of New York State, Catskills are responsive

[00:00:51] You're listening to Inside The Line, the Catskill Mountains Podcast

[00:01:04] Alright, episode 150, so Jamie Kennard is here tonight

[00:01:11] This guy is a legend

[00:01:15] Right? Right, Jamie's just like, no, no, no

[00:01:17] Yeah, he's gonna be Mr. Modest sitting there with just a big shit-eating grin on his face knowing that he's done it

[00:01:25] He's done, so Jamie has done 81 Peaks skiing, 81 Peaks 46 and the Catskill 3500

[00:01:34] So it's tonight we have him here tonight to talk about that and to talk about his film, Variable

[00:01:39] Which is, looks absolutely fantastic, I'm very excited for that

[00:01:43] So, yeah, so welcome to the show Jamie

[00:01:46] Thanks, thanks for having me guys

[00:01:48] Glad to be here

[00:01:48] Yeah, it's great to have you here

[00:01:50] Um, once again, I sound like I'm under the weather because I have a little cold going on

[00:01:54] So, I'm going back and forth of being hot and cold and stuff like that

[00:01:58] So, just bear with me, alright?

[00:02:01] I'll mute it as many times as I can

[00:02:03] You'll be layering and de-layering like a mountain hike in the winter

[00:02:09] Yeah, yeah, definitely

[00:02:11] And that'll be, it'll be like that

[00:02:12] So, recent news, got some recent news real quickly

[00:02:15] In Hunter, on November 30th, so it was like three days ago

[00:02:19] Uh, there was a wilderness rescue

[00:02:21] Raybook Dispatch received a call from a parent concerned about their son hiking on Indian Head

[00:02:26] Forest Ranger Peterson spoke to the 18 year old from Long Island on the phone

[00:02:30] And the hiker indicated that he was on a snowy trail and not been packed down

[00:02:34] And was tired, wet, and cold

[00:02:36] Sounds like winter

[00:02:37] Uh, Ranger Peterson convinced the hiker to turn around and start heading back to the trailhead

[00:02:42] Rather than attempting the summit

[00:02:43] When Rangers Fox and Peterson successfully located the subject

[00:02:47] His pants were frozen to his legs

[00:02:49] Sounds like jeans or khakis to me

[00:02:51] Uh, Rangers treated the hiker for mild hypothermia and assisted him to the trailhead

[00:02:56] Recesses were clear at 5.35 p.m.

[00:02:58] So that's good

[00:02:58] 3 p.m.

[00:02:59] 5.35, so it was, it was dark

[00:03:01] Just getting dark

[00:03:02] This didn't have to go for a, a 12 o'clock rescue

[00:03:05] Well, at 5.35, I'm gonna say it's dark

[00:03:10] True, true

[00:03:11] There, there's been a lot of, uh, overcast, gray skies

[00:03:17] At, uh, 4 o'clock, it's well into dusk

[00:03:21] 5.35

[00:03:22] This, this youngster was probably wishing he had a, a flashlight or something

[00:03:27] Yeah, not a cell phone

[00:03:29] But pants frozen to his legs

[00:03:31] Uh, we can all say that we've been there and we have done that, correct?

[00:03:36] What about you, Jamie? You gonna admit to that?

[00:03:38] I've done so many dumb things in my, uh, mountainous career

[00:03:43] Um, I, I don't know about frozen, frozen pant legs, but probably something equivalent

[00:03:48] So

[00:03:48] Yeah, well, every, every skier typically at least their first or second season experiences the

[00:03:55] Peeling the pants off their legs after a day of powder skiing

[00:04:01] Yeah, I mean, drop it into that powder and stuff and then hiking, you know, as well, you know, I've, I've had that when I was stupid and I did khakis, uh, in the winter, but I also had long chimes underneath. So didn't freeze to my, my legs, but I have been there and done that we learn and we move on. And that's why you also listen to episode 146, right?

[00:04:23] That's it, man. That's where we went over the gear, your essential gear for winter hiking and the Catskills

[00:04:28] Yeah, it was good. It was good. So as we, we, we know from the, the report that he was hiking without snowshoes. And we all know that. I mean, most of us, I don't know, Jamie, if you've been hiking up there, but you've heard reports that there's been over a foot of snow in the Catskills, even at the lower elevations

[00:04:46] I'm sure we'll get into it, but I have done three epic hikes in the last week on snowshoes.

[00:04:52] Um, good for you.

[00:04:53] So I'm well aware.

[00:04:55] Nice.

[00:04:56] Yeah. All's I know is, uh, I can imagine what, if he was going around the north side of Indian head, the, the snow, he must've been encountering.

[00:05:08] So the north or the, the east, west?

[00:05:11] Well, the northeast side.

[00:05:12] Okay. Yeah. Yeah. The steep side.

[00:05:14] Yeah.

[00:05:14] Yeah. Yeah.

[00:05:16] You know, if you're, and if you're 18 years old and you look at a topo map, that's what you're thinking. Oh, I'm going to go up the steep radical part. Yeah.

[00:05:25] With my Levi's on.

[00:05:27] Yeah. Right. And it didn't say if he had, uh, what's it called? Like any spikes on or anything like that. So it's pretty, that's good for him for, uh,

[00:05:36] Yeah.

[00:05:37] Getting out and good for his mom to his parents to call about that. Cause he would have been out there and he would have been.

[00:05:43] That would have been bad.

[00:05:45] Yeah.

[00:05:45] Shit out a lot. Cause it kind of, it gets, it's getting cold at night. It's getting very cold.

[00:05:49] Yeah. Well, you got to imagine by five 35, if he wasn't making a lot of forward progress or any progress that he was getting hypothermic.

[00:05:58] Right. Yeah.

[00:06:00] I think something people don't always realize is that sometimes Rangers want to get that call earlier rather than probably all the time. They want to get that call earlier later. So, um, you know, I think just for anyone that's listening, you know, if you're having real doubts, you know, don't, don't hesitate because the longer you wait, the worse off you're going to be, the later it's going to be. And, um, it just can make things really, really difficult.

[00:06:26] So, um, of course be smart in the, in the first place, but, but never hesitate, um, to, to make that call if you feel like you need to.

[00:06:36] Yeah.

[00:06:37] Yeah. And he was, you know, where he was hiking, that's fairly accessible. The first half of that is fairly accessible to get to him.

[00:06:45] Yeah. So, uh, good for the Rangers once again, yeah. Fox and Peterson really ripping it up as always another big topic that we, we I've, I've looked up and we've talked about, uh, together, Ted and, uh, Jamie, I don't know if you've seen this, but Canadian hiker found, uh, after being lost for six weeks, six fricking weeks.

[00:07:07] That is absolutely insane. So, uh, he was out in the Canadian wilderness up. I would, it says British Columbia and you know, that's, that's a big chunk of land when we're going all the way up to, uh, like the Yukon peninsula and stuff like that all the way up top.

[00:07:23] And I looked up where he was and this is wild up there, up North 10,000 foot mountains, stuff like that. Uh, in the Redfern Kylie principal park.

[00:07:36] Now he was supposed to be on a 10 day camping trip. And unfortunately he went in there and was out for 50 days and it's just really, there's not a lot of details coming into it.

[00:07:48] I've looked at every single report and it's just the thing he says is like, they were, he was walking on a trail and two people found him and they took them.

[00:07:57] They were just like, wait a minute, you're missing. Uh, we need to get you to the hospital. And then that's like it. And there's a picture that I saw of him with like covers over his eyes.

[00:08:06] Like his, like it's weird. Like I, so, so if he's up in an altitude like that, presumably ill-prepared, certainly not for 50 days.

[00:08:18] What is he doing for UV ray protection with reflecting light off the snow? If he's out there and, and depending on how much tree cover there was or there wasn't, I mean, he, this kid could have been snow blind.

[00:08:32] That's probably what it was. Yeah. That's probably.

[00:08:35] Oh no.

[00:08:36] Yeah. And like a bunch of, uh, he was out for 10 days. I said 10 days and that's when the family started to get a little bit concerned and they called and then there was a huge search, 200 people, uh, 800 hours of searching. And then they were like, let's, let's give this up, man. This is crazy.

[00:08:54] They gave up on them. They gave up on them. Wow. Can you imagine below zero is what it came out to at certain times. And, you know, if you've ever, if you ever look at where the, uh, the red friend forest is, like I said, it is way up there. It's past Banff. It's past, uh, like, uh, Oh, yoho national park or something like that. Uh, it's, it's up there.

[00:09:15] And this is just absolutely insane. The guy was probably trying to ski all these high peaks up there, 10,000 high peaks. And he was just like, yeah, I heard he had just finished watching the trailer to this up and coming documentary called variable and got them all stoked up. Apparently the disclaimer at the end of the movie wasn't bold or prominent enough.

[00:09:38] And I've been getting so many calls from Canadian parents yelling at me. So yeah.

[00:09:42] Yeah. Yep.

[00:09:43] A, a, a Jesus. Yeah. That's, it's crazy. Uh, feet now, Ted, you had some notes for this.

[00:09:52] Yeah. So like you said, there's not a lot of much detail on this story yet, but the first thing I remembered is her friend, Robert shook, who was the fellow in the Northern cascades who was out for 30 days.

[00:10:08] Remember him with his dog. So this, so this fellow beat, beat Robert by, um, 20 days sets our new, our new record for 2024, 50 days lost and unaccounted for.

[00:10:25] So there's not enough. I don't, there's not enough time left this year, unless somebody has already been out there for a while to beat this fellow's record of 50.

[00:10:34] So I don't know. I saw a, uh, a bulletin go out about a missing hiker up in the Adirondacks now.

[00:10:40] Oh, really?

[00:10:41] Yeah. They gave details of what he's wearing, but they, they have no clue of where he is. It's been lost for like 11 days. I think.

[00:10:48] Really? Uh, well that, that doesn't sound like it's going to have a good ending.

[00:10:52] Don't know. It's 5th, 30, 20, 30 days, 50 days, whatever. I mean, up there and, and like near the, like, it's seriously near the Yukon Peninsula. Like that is way up there. And I was just like, wow. Like this guy is in the remote places, uh, that I've ever seen. Basically. It's just like frozen tundra. Uh, there's mountains right when he walks in. I don't know how far he got into there. So of where his camping was like, once again, there's not much detail, but just, it's just so crazy.

[00:11:21] That you could survive 50 days. And he said something about, he had a lot of peanut butter to help him out. Peanut butter is protein, man. That's good stuff.

[00:11:30] Yeah. But who goes hiking with that many days worth of peanut butter with them?

[00:11:34] That's true. 50 days.

[00:11:35] Yeah.

[00:11:36] And it didn't say anything about water. You know how he, if he had to filter water, I highly doubt that he did. I mean, that's good old glacier water coming from up there.

[00:11:44] I think he needs to try out for the TV show alone. If he's, if he's able to pull this off, he's.

[00:11:49] 50 days. Good point.

[00:11:52] Naked and afraid out in the Yukon Peninsula. That's probably what he was, but crazy stuff. Just, it's, it's crazy. What's coming up and it's, and it's winter. We're getting all these.

[00:12:02] Uh, you know, like reports and stuff, you know, New Hampshire, Adirondacks, we're going to start hearing all this stuff of people going out ill-prepared and, you know, just pack for everything.

[00:12:12] Everything and everything that's going to hit you in the, in the winter, because that's, it's, it's, it's a, it's a beast. And, you know, Jamie will talk about some of that tonight. I got, I got a really good question for the beginning and I can't wait for that.

[00:12:23] I can't wait for that.

[00:12:23] I don't know how, but yeah, that's about the news. I wanted to just do a quick news really quick so we can get onto Jamie because we got a lot to talk about Jamie. I don't know. This, this might be a record for the longest.

[00:12:35] Depends on how, how, uh, how the questions go. I can't, I'm excited. So thank you to the monthly supporters, Darren White. Thank you for Mike Sawatowski, John C, Tom H, Betsy A, Denise, Vanessa, Joseph, Jim C, Michael. And yeah. Uh, thank you guys very much for supporting the show. Really appreciate it. It, uh, once again, goes back in the show and whatever doesn't go in the show goes back into the Catskills for a donation. We should be doing that soon.

[00:13:02] So there are also sponsors of the show. Thank you very much to the sponsors, uh, Outdoor Chronicles Photography. Capture your love story against breathtaking backdrops with Outdoor Chronicles Photography. Molly specializes in adventure couple photography and she'll immortalize your moments amidst stunning landscapes of the Catskills, Adirondacks, and White Mountains. She'll craft timeless images that reflect your unique bond in nature's grandeur. Embark on an unforgettable photographic journey with Outdoor Chronicles Photography. Don't hesitate to get a hold of Molly on all platforms.

[00:13:31] Also, you want to learn anything about the wilderness? Discover Trailbound Project. Our expert-led hiking and backpacking education programs offer unparalleled outdoor experiences. Whether you're a beginner or seasoned adventurer, join us to learn essential skills, explore stunning trails, and connect with nature. Start your journey today with Trailbound Project and unlock the wonders of the great outsource.

[00:13:53] So, Hard Ciders, once again, you want to support the show, you want to give back to the show, donate us a Hard Cider. It's supposed to be a coffee, but I changed it to Hard Ciders because that's what the show is. It's good stuff. It's better than a coffee. Unless you're Ted and you drink coffee throughout this.

[00:14:07] So, also, mentions. Got some mentions here. People are mentioning us, which is cool. So, who's Outdoors? Tom, once again, previously on the show, went up a little sketchy area of Indian Head and Palinville Overlook via the Climbers Route. This is a little sketchy area, I gotta admit. I've been through there at least twice, and I'm not wanting to do that anytime soon, especially with Weird Rope.

[00:14:35] Yeah, I saw the pictures that Tom and Joe posted with that line strung through the rocks, rubbing on the rocks, people hiking over it, per his photos with spikes on.

[00:14:52] Sorry, Tom.

[00:14:53] Yeah, just about anything and everything that could be done to a rope to compromise, if not ruin it, right?

[00:15:03] Sorry, Tom.

[00:15:04] Yeah, I mean, it's just, geez.

[00:15:06] It's scary. Especially there. There's a big drop.

[00:15:08] Yeah, I remember one time a prominent Catskill hiker told me this story about they were doing the Burroughs Range Traverse, heading from Slide down to Woodland Valley, and they got to the crack and there was a rope strung.

[00:15:24] So they used the rope. And there was four of them, and the fourth one who was going down realized, as he's holding onto this rope, that this really wasn't a climbing rope. It was somebody's clothesline that they brought out to use with them for rope purposes.

[00:15:43] So be leery of rope you find strung in the woods.

[00:15:49] Yeah.

[00:15:50] Yeah.

[00:15:50] You don't know how long it's been out there.

[00:15:53] You know, weather corrupts the rope, and especially this is not Frodo's rope that he got from the elves. It's not going to last forever, and it's not going to pull down and stuff.

[00:16:02] Yeah.

[00:16:03] You know, Tom, good for you for going up there, and you know, you had a couple people to help you out.

[00:16:08] Yeah.

[00:16:08] Well, and that looks like they had a great time, and they made it safely, but just next time you guys, anyone goes through there, be on guard, you know, about that equipment.

[00:16:19] Yeah.

[00:16:20] Tad, Tom was the only tag.

[00:16:22] So that's okay.

[00:16:23] That's okay.

[00:16:23] We had a lot last week.

[00:16:25] Shame on Joe and others.

[00:16:28] Yeah.

[00:16:28] What's going on?

[00:16:29] We're going to put them on.

[00:16:30] What's going on, Jamie?

[00:16:30] You didn't tag us.

[00:16:31] What the heck?

[00:16:32] Expect a big block of coal in your gators, your winter gators.

[00:16:38] And Julie.

[00:16:39] You know what?

[00:16:39] You know what?

[00:16:40] Julie didn't tag us, but I'm going to tag her right now.

[00:16:43] She finished skiing the 3,500 peaks, and Jamie was there with her.

[00:16:47] Awesome accomplishment.

[00:16:48] The first woman to ever do that.

[00:16:49] So congratulations, Julie, if you ever listen to the show.

[00:16:52] I hope you do.

[00:16:53] We talked about that a while ago, and you had two peaks left, I think.

[00:16:57] I think she had two or three peaks with Fern Catterskill High Peak.

[00:17:00] She had three peaks left this year, and that's what she did this past week.

[00:17:06] She did, well, four peaks total.

[00:17:08] Three outings, four peaks.

[00:17:10] Wow.

[00:17:10] You were with her, right?

[00:17:11] I was with her for all of them.

[00:17:13] Nice.

[00:17:14] Nice.

[00:17:14] You guys are badass.

[00:17:15] That's all I got to say.

[00:17:16] Crazy.

[00:17:16] Good, perfect conditions, I'm guessing.

[00:17:18] Yeah.

[00:17:19] Super awesome.

[00:17:19] Yeah, she was very excited and just an epic finish for her.

[00:17:24] Yeah.

[00:17:25] So awesome.

[00:17:26] Julie, I tagged you in this because you don't tag me.

[00:17:28] Your stories are amazing, but you didn't tag me.

[00:17:32] I don't know, especially with-

[00:17:33] You have to be royalty for her.

[00:17:35] I know.

[00:17:36] I got to admit, Julie, something else.

[00:17:38] Yeah, you're just a commoner, so don't get tagged.

[00:17:41] So rate the show as well.

[00:17:45] Do you guys remember the rating that I got, a one-star rating that we got about the music?

[00:17:51] So wrong.

[00:17:53] Yeah, yeah.

[00:17:54] Jamie, did you hear about that?

[00:17:55] Did you see my post?

[00:17:56] I did, yeah.

[00:17:57] I saw that, yeah.

[00:17:59] Was it you, Jamie?

[00:18:00] Was it you?

[00:18:01] You saw it.

[00:18:02] Was it you?

[00:18:02] Do you like heavy metal music?

[00:18:04] It was not me.

[00:18:05] You know, I grew up playing in punk rock bands, so I'm all for the loud music.

[00:18:12] Good, good.

[00:18:12] Yeah, this was different.

[00:18:14] It was different.

[00:18:14] One star said something about the podcast.

[00:18:17] It loves the topics, loves stuff like that, but they can't bear the music in the beginning,

[00:18:21] so they just shut it off.

[00:18:23] It's one minute and 14 seconds.

[00:18:25] You can skip that easily in any thing because of your technology.

[00:18:29] But you know what?

[00:18:30] Whoever did that, please get back to me and we can chat and I'll maybe lower it one time

[00:18:35] and you see how you like it or something.

[00:18:36] But that's the way we roll.

[00:18:38] That's the way it's been since the beginning, so I can't change it.

[00:18:42] So it's awesome.

[00:18:44] I think it's awesome.

[00:18:44] It's metal.

[00:18:46] So what are we drinking tonight?

[00:18:47] Jamie, do you got anything?

[00:18:48] I saw you sipping something.

[00:18:50] Well, this is not going to be new to any hikers, but I have a Westkill Catterskill IPA

[00:18:59] for a couple of reasons.

[00:19:00] One, it's pretty much my favorite beer out there.

[00:19:04] Two, the day that I skied Southwest Hunter, and I just found my Ski the Catskills tally sheet today.

[00:19:14] The day that I skied Southwest Hunter was January 25th, 2014.

[00:19:20] And when I got down to the parking lot and was loading my skis into the car, there was a couple walking their dog.

[00:19:30] And the guy looked over and noticed my skis and realized that they were not regular skis.

[00:19:36] And he got very excited, and he asked if I had just skied something.

[00:19:41] And it turns out he was also a backcountry skier.

[00:19:45] And they had just moved in down the street to the Spruceton Inn, which if anyone travels on Spruceton Road,

[00:19:52] it's the little motel that used to be the Schwarzenegger Sunshine House,

[00:19:56] which is almost directly across from Westkill Brewing.

[00:19:59] That individual is Steven Weinberg, who did the can art for the Catterskill IPA.

[00:20:07] Nice.

[00:20:08] And he quickly became my best friend up here in the Catskills,

[00:20:13] and my backcountry skiing partner, and fishing buddy, and all-around sort of outdoor pal.

[00:20:21] So just to bring it back around to my choice of beverage tonight,

[00:20:27] and also to meeting adventure partners out there.

[00:20:31] Yeah.

[00:20:33] Somebody hasn't had Westkill in a long time.

[00:20:35] I don't think we've had Westkill.

[00:20:37] I don't remember what Julie had.

[00:20:39] Julie has like 800 different—she tries every IPA that's out there.

[00:20:43] She tries everything.

[00:20:44] Yeah.

[00:20:44] Well, Westkill—I mean, you know, in Westkill, they're amazing folks.

[00:20:47] They're huge supporters of the outdoors.

[00:20:50] They're supporting my film when it's playing here in Woodstock.

[00:20:54] And, yeah, Mike Barconi and everyone at Westkill are super awesome

[00:20:58] and just support everything about the outdoors.

[00:21:01] So I love those guys.

[00:21:03] Nice.

[00:21:03] Nice.

[00:21:03] Well, good.

[00:21:04] Good.

[00:21:04] Tad, what about you?

[00:21:05] You got your—

[00:21:06] Oh, yeah.

[00:21:06] Well, here.

[00:21:07] You want me to crack it?

[00:21:08] Yeah, go right ahead.

[00:21:10] Ooh, that was good.

[00:21:11] Yeah.

[00:21:11] So I am in honor of Julie.

[00:21:16] Julie, I won't tag your show, McGuire.

[00:21:21] I'm having a Catskill Brewery Devil's Path IPA, which she related to me is the best IPA out of the Catskills.

[00:21:35] So—

[00:21:35] It's her favorite.

[00:21:35] Yeah, so here's my—I'm holding it up to the camera to legitimize it.

[00:21:40] The Devil's Path IPA in honor of her epic skiing adventure.

[00:21:47] So, cool.

[00:21:48] Cheers.

[00:21:49] Yeah, yeah, cheers.

[00:21:50] I'm having a—

[00:21:50] I'm having a—

[00:21:51] I'm having a—

[00:21:51] Yeah, I'm having a Hudson North Camel Apple.

[00:21:54] Very, very good.

[00:21:55] Hudson North is good stuff.

[00:21:57] So, trying to—

[00:21:59] I can actually smell it.

[00:22:00] I smell like some apple.

[00:22:02] Yeah, geez.

[00:22:03] I can't smell anything right now, so—

[00:22:04] Good for you.

[00:22:05] Good.

[00:22:06] Good for me.

[00:22:07] So, previous hikes.

[00:22:09] Jamie, I mean, let's go with you.

[00:22:11] You had a pretty—both of you, Tad.

[00:22:13] I'm going to say, let's start with me.

[00:22:15] I didn't do anything.

[00:22:16] I didn't do crap.

[00:22:17] So, yeah, that's me.

[00:22:18] So, Jamie, how about you, sir?

[00:22:20] What were you up to this weekend?

[00:22:22] And epic adventures.

[00:22:23] So, I'll work, I guess, backwards—

[00:22:26] or I'll work from my most recent,

[00:22:28] which was this Saturday with Julie,

[00:22:30] with her ski finish on Catterskill High Peak.

[00:22:34] So, when I've been tagging along with Julie,

[00:22:37] I guess just to back up a little bit with her story,

[00:22:38] I've been filming with Julie for—

[00:22:41] this is, I guess, the third winter.

[00:22:43] So, I've been following her ski adventures around.

[00:22:46] But I've been doing it on snowshoes

[00:22:49] because when I'm carrying camera gear,

[00:22:50] it's just a lot easier to maneuver

[00:22:52] and pay attention to the camera gear.

[00:22:56] And if I have ski poles in my hands,

[00:22:57] and skis are just more difficult.

[00:23:00] So, but we went up to Catterskill High Peak

[00:23:03] on Saturday

[00:23:04] and mostly broke trail

[00:23:08] up through the steep stuff.

[00:23:10] And it was incredibly deep.

[00:23:14] I have some footage,

[00:23:16] and Julie took some photos.

[00:23:18] But at points—

[00:23:19] and I was on snowshoes.

[00:23:20] I was sinking—

[00:23:22] and I'm six foot one.

[00:23:22] I was sinking to my hips

[00:23:24] and up to my belly button

[00:23:26] at some points.

[00:23:27] Nice.

[00:23:28] So, it was super deep.

[00:23:31] You know, when you're on skis,

[00:23:32] you have a little bit more float.

[00:23:34] So, Julie—

[00:23:35] and this was her adventure.

[00:23:37] So, it was her choice,

[00:23:38] you know,

[00:23:39] how to navigate the cliffs

[00:23:40] and what the path was.

[00:23:42] So, I was really just following.

[00:23:44] And so, she has a lot more float.

[00:23:45] And then I'm behind her

[00:23:47] more or less breaking trail.

[00:23:49] I'm sort of in her ski tracks,

[00:23:50] but then I'm punching through.

[00:23:52] So, that was incredibly hard.

[00:23:54] The day prior,

[00:23:55] she and I did fur,

[00:23:57] which wasn't too bad.

[00:23:59] Still deep snow up top.

[00:24:01] But last week,

[00:24:03] after that first snowstorm,

[00:24:05] she and I did Lone and Rocky.

[00:24:08] And that was a 13-hour round trip.

[00:24:15] And I'm not exaggerating

[00:24:18] when I say

[00:24:19] it was probably the hardest thing

[00:24:22] that I have done

[00:24:23] out of any of my Catskill

[00:24:26] or Adirondack hikes

[00:24:28] or ski adventures.

[00:24:29] Physically, it was the most draining.

[00:24:33] Just an incredibly hard day.

[00:24:34] Just punching through

[00:24:36] super deep snow up there.

[00:24:38] And that was wet snow, right?

[00:24:40] Like, it was just a hobby.

[00:24:41] It was wet down below.

[00:24:42] It got deep.

[00:24:43] It was sort of mixed up top.

[00:24:45] And, you know,

[00:24:48] that day,

[00:24:49] my personal mistake,

[00:24:50] because I'm carrying camera gear,

[00:24:52] I did not bring any ski poles at all.

[00:24:56] And so,

[00:24:57] I was breaking trail on snowshoes,

[00:24:59] but with nothing in my hands.

[00:25:01] And so,

[00:25:02] it was just a full-on sort of leg,

[00:25:06] you know,

[00:25:07] abdomen workout.

[00:25:09] And it was exhausting.

[00:25:10] And it was completely the wrong thing to do.

[00:25:14] You know,

[00:25:14] I had them in the car

[00:25:15] and I sort of just forgot

[00:25:16] when we left the car

[00:25:19] because I was fixated on getting,

[00:25:21] you know,

[00:25:21] the filming underway.

[00:25:22] And,

[00:25:24] yeah,

[00:25:24] it was super hard.

[00:25:26] And there were lots of things

[00:25:28] that happened out there that day.

[00:25:29] You know,

[00:25:30] ski bindings

[00:25:31] sort of breaking

[00:25:33] and then getting fixed again.

[00:25:36] you know,

[00:25:37] phones running out of batteries

[00:25:39] and,

[00:25:39] you know,

[00:25:40] getting snow in the charging port

[00:25:42] so you couldn't use your battery pack to,

[00:25:45] you know,

[00:25:45] and just,

[00:25:46] just lots of little things

[00:25:47] to add up to a super long day out there.

[00:25:51] And,

[00:25:51] yeah,

[00:25:52] probably the hardest thing I've done

[00:25:53] in a very,

[00:25:54] very long time.

[00:25:55] But,

[00:25:56] but we did it.

[00:25:57] And we got out around,

[00:25:59] we started at 8 a.m.

[00:26:01] and we got out around 9 p.m.

[00:26:03] Wow.

[00:26:04] Yeah.

[00:26:05] Yeah.

[00:26:05] It's a long day.

[00:26:06] A long day.

[00:26:07] Yeah.

[00:26:07] And was Julie looking back at you

[00:26:09] and just like,

[00:26:10] come on,

[00:26:10] let's go move it.

[00:26:12] You know,

[00:26:12] we were both,

[00:26:13] it wasn't just me struggling.

[00:26:14] I mean,

[00:26:15] it was hard for both of us.

[00:26:17] Yeah.

[00:26:18] I don't know if she would say

[00:26:19] it was the hardest thing

[00:26:20] that she's done,

[00:26:20] but I think it was probably up there

[00:26:23] in her,

[00:26:23] in her top,

[00:26:24] top three.

[00:26:26] Yeah.

[00:26:26] It's a real,

[00:26:27] you know,

[00:26:27] I think it's also one of those things

[00:26:28] for,

[00:26:28] for anyone,

[00:26:29] you know,

[00:26:29] that first winter hike

[00:26:32] that you get out there,

[00:26:33] you're,

[00:26:33] you know,

[00:26:33] you just forget some things

[00:26:34] from the year before.

[00:26:36] Um,

[00:26:38] and,

[00:26:38] you know,

[00:26:39] it's,

[00:26:39] it's easy to,

[00:26:40] to forget all of the little things

[00:26:42] that you need to remember,

[00:26:43] you know,

[00:26:44] that,

[00:26:44] that's those six months

[00:26:45] over the summer

[00:26:46] and spring and fall.

[00:26:47] You just,

[00:26:47] you forget some of those,

[00:26:48] those little things.

[00:26:50] Um,

[00:26:51] and this was just kind of

[00:26:52] a big,

[00:26:52] a big eye opener,

[00:26:54] uh,

[00:26:54] reminder,

[00:26:55] um,

[00:26:55] despite having,

[00:26:56] you know,

[00:26:56] done stuff out in the mountains

[00:26:58] in the winter for,

[00:26:59] you know,

[00:27:00] the last 20 years,

[00:27:01] you just,

[00:27:01] you really have to go out

[00:27:02] that first time,

[00:27:04] super prepared,

[00:27:04] and really just have everything,

[00:27:06] you know,

[00:27:07] triple check it before you go out

[00:27:08] and,

[00:27:08] um,

[00:27:09] make sure you have everything

[00:27:10] that you need.

[00:27:11] Um,

[00:27:12] so,

[00:27:13] yeah.

[00:27:13] What,

[00:27:13] what was your route?

[00:27:14] Did you go,

[00:27:15] what was like straight up,

[00:27:16] uh,

[00:27:17] loan and then to Rocky

[00:27:18] or did you go tables

[00:27:19] to loan Rocky?

[00:27:20] And then we,

[00:27:21] we did,

[00:27:22] um,

[00:27:23] and I always get stuff mixed up,

[00:27:24] but I think we did loan Rocky

[00:27:25] and back over alone.

[00:27:27] So we actually did three,

[00:27:28] uh,

[00:27:30] three mountains that,

[00:27:31] um,

[00:27:32] and part of that was just Julie,

[00:27:35] you know,

[00:27:35] I hadn't been up there

[00:27:36] in over 10 years

[00:27:37] and this is her,

[00:27:38] um,

[00:27:39] this is her project

[00:27:40] and you know,

[00:27:41] it's,

[00:27:41] it's her route planning.

[00:27:43] Um,

[00:27:44] and in some of her previous hikes,

[00:27:47] she has gotten caught up

[00:27:49] in some,

[00:27:50] in some nasty bushwhacking

[00:27:51] and she wanted to avoid

[00:27:54] going down something

[00:27:55] that we hadn't traveled up.

[00:27:57] So part of her thinking was

[00:27:58] let's just backtrack

[00:27:59] the way that we came.

[00:28:01] So we know exactly

[00:28:02] what we're getting into

[00:28:03] on the way out.

[00:28:05] So,

[00:28:05] yeah.

[00:28:06] And that's just a strategy.

[00:28:07] Um,

[00:28:08] but it also meant that

[00:28:09] we were essentially doing

[00:28:11] a third mountain,

[00:28:12] um,

[00:28:12] that day,

[00:28:13] which under those conditions

[00:28:15] just made it,

[00:28:16] um,

[00:28:17] made it a little more

[00:28:17] strenuous for us both.

[00:28:20] Nice.

[00:28:21] Yeah,

[00:28:21] but we got it done.

[00:28:22] Yeah.

[00:28:22] Excellent.

[00:28:24] Peace.

[00:28:24] Peace.

[00:28:25] So,

[00:28:26] Ted,

[00:28:26] what about you?

[00:28:28] Oh,

[00:28:29] so I hiked,

[00:28:29] uh,

[00:28:30] on Black Friday

[00:28:32] and I hiked on Saturday,

[00:28:34] uh,

[00:28:35] Black Friday.

[00:28:36] I,

[00:28:36] well,

[00:28:37] first of all,

[00:28:37] did you ever figure out

[00:28:39] what mountain

[00:28:39] that photo was

[00:28:41] that I sent you?

[00:28:42] The one I posted.

[00:28:43] The ledges are mysterious.

[00:28:46] Like,

[00:28:46] mysterious.

[00:28:47] Yeah.

[00:28:48] Was that?

[00:28:50] Yeah.

[00:28:51] So I'm,

[00:28:51] I'm going to give you,

[00:28:52] I'm going to give you a clue.

[00:28:53] Do you want a clue

[00:28:54] that's going to give it away?

[00:28:55] North,

[00:28:56] south,

[00:28:56] east,

[00:28:56] or west?

[00:28:57] Um,

[00:28:58] where,

[00:28:59] from where I was taking

[00:28:59] the photo

[00:29:01] from the east

[00:29:02] looking west.

[00:29:04] Oh,

[00:29:04] oh,

[00:29:04] that kind of screws my,

[00:29:06] oh,

[00:29:07] wow.

[00:29:07] Is that

[00:29:08] cataractical high peak?

[00:29:10] No.

[00:29:11] No.

[00:29:11] Oh God,

[00:29:12] that's so off.

[00:29:12] The profile doesn't even

[00:29:13] look that close.

[00:29:14] It looks like the ledges

[00:29:15] on cataractical high peak.

[00:29:16] Well,

[00:29:17] but it doesn't have

[00:29:18] the shark fin appearance.

[00:29:20] Okay.

[00:29:21] Damn,

[00:29:21] that's tough.

[00:29:21] All right.

[00:29:22] So the next,

[00:29:26] I'll tell you,

[00:29:27] where do you think

[00:29:27] I was standing

[00:29:28] when I took the photo?

[00:29:29] I have no clue.

[00:29:31] In a fire tower.

[00:29:32] Oh.

[00:29:33] Well,

[00:29:33] on the steps

[00:29:34] of a fire tower,

[00:29:35] I wasn't in the cab

[00:29:36] itself because they're

[00:29:37] closed.

[00:29:38] Jamie's,

[00:29:38] I can see Jamie's

[00:29:39] thinking now,

[00:29:40] he's zeroing in.

[00:29:41] Now,

[00:29:41] can Stosh

[00:29:42] beat Jamie

[00:29:43] or is Jamie

[00:29:44] going to do

[00:29:44] an end around

[00:29:45] and get it?

[00:29:45] Well,

[00:29:46] where do I see the photo?

[00:29:47] That's what I need to know.

[00:29:47] Oh yeah,

[00:29:48] hold on.

[00:29:48] Let me see if I can,

[00:29:50] ah,

[00:29:51] I can,

[00:29:52] I can do it.

[00:29:53] Hold on.

[00:29:53] Can you pull it up?

[00:29:54] Okay.

[00:29:55] I can.

[00:29:55] All right,

[00:29:56] fans.

[00:29:56] All right,

[00:29:57] fans.

[00:29:58] Stosh is pulling up

[00:29:59] the photo.

[00:30:00] You're going to,

[00:30:00] you'll know what's

[00:30:01] on the screen

[00:30:01] when Jamie goes,

[00:30:03] wow,

[00:30:03] that's a damn good photo.

[00:30:04] I don't think I can.

[00:30:06] No?

[00:30:06] Because it's on my,

[00:30:07] you sent that to my

[00:30:08] messages,

[00:30:09] right?

[00:30:10] Oh,

[00:30:10] you can't bring it up

[00:30:11] on your,

[00:30:12] did you send it?

[00:30:13] It got,

[00:30:14] it got posted too.

[00:30:15] I think it was,

[00:30:16] um,

[00:30:17] uh,

[00:30:18] I think it got,

[00:30:19] uh,

[00:30:20] reposted,

[00:30:20] on the 3500 club.

[00:30:23] Oh,

[00:30:23] that was,

[00:30:24] yeah.

[00:30:25] Is that one?

[00:30:26] That is it.

[00:30:26] Let me see.

[00:30:27] Let me see.

[00:30:28] You did it so fast.

[00:30:29] I'm like,

[00:30:30] you were in and out so quickly.

[00:30:34] Yeah,

[00:30:34] that's it.

[00:30:35] That's it.

[00:30:36] So look at some,

[00:30:37] like,

[00:30:38] it looks like it's a story.

[00:30:40] Unavailable.

[00:30:41] Oh,

[00:30:42] so,

[00:30:42] so,

[00:30:42] I mean,

[00:30:43] I mean,

[00:30:43] I don't know if you can see that,

[00:30:44] Jamie,

[00:30:45] like that's a tough.

[00:30:47] Okay.

[00:30:49] He,

[00:30:51] so I'm,

[00:30:52] I'm going to,

[00:30:53] I'm standing on a fire tower.

[00:30:54] I'm shooting to the West.

[00:30:56] Stosh thought it was cater skill.

[00:30:59] High peak.

[00:31:00] I'm going to say mountain tremper.

[00:31:02] Oh,

[00:31:02] I think there's too much.

[00:31:05] There's too many ledges for tremper.

[00:31:08] That's tough.

[00:31:09] All right.

[00:31:10] So here,

[00:31:10] this is the giveaway clue.

[00:31:12] If you don't instantly guess it now,

[00:31:15] I'm going to be gravely disappointed.

[00:31:19] It is Graham.

[00:31:22] Close,

[00:31:22] but no cigar.

[00:31:24] It's still forbidden territory.

[00:31:26] Let's double top.

[00:31:27] Then double top.

[00:31:29] It is.

[00:31:30] I was,

[00:31:30] you know,

[00:31:30] my first thought was Graham,

[00:31:32] but yeah,

[00:31:33] double top,

[00:31:33] double top doesn't have that many ledges.

[00:31:36] It doesn't seem like on the,

[00:31:38] well,

[00:31:38] but you,

[00:31:39] do you ever go up at that way?

[00:31:41] You would,

[00:31:41] that's the way that you would approach it,

[00:31:43] you know,

[00:31:44] from frost Valley road.

[00:31:46] Okay.

[00:31:48] And I've been up at many times from that direction,

[00:31:51] but the,

[00:31:51] the second top,

[00:31:53] the forbidden summit is somewhat obscured by the area that we're allowed to go to

[00:32:00] at present.

[00:32:01] So it gives it a unique appearance.

[00:32:03] That's what I thought when I looked over there and saw it.

[00:32:06] So,

[00:32:06] all right,

[00:32:06] it was rather,

[00:32:07] it was a fun day.

[00:32:08] Friday,

[00:32:09] I was just clicking off some all trail mileage and hiked up to red hill.

[00:32:13] Never been there before.

[00:32:14] Uh,

[00:32:15] it's a easy hike for somebody of reasonable fitness or better.

[00:32:19] Highly recommended to take your friends and pals there when they're starting out.

[00:32:24] Now,

[00:32:24] Saturday,

[00:32:25] I did two hikes.

[00:32:26] Uh,

[00:32:27] I started off by going to,

[00:32:29] uh,

[00:32:30] a balsam lake fire tower.

[00:32:33] And it was very interesting and unusual morning.

[00:32:36] I know you want to move it along.

[00:32:37] So I'm not going to tell you about the,

[00:32:38] the,

[00:32:39] um,

[00:32:40] the Lexus from New Jersey and the parking lot that I had to push three,

[00:32:44] maybe four,

[00:32:45] maybe five times.

[00:32:46] Okay.

[00:32:47] The guy just kept getting stuck and all I wanted to do is go like,

[00:32:50] okay.

[00:32:51] But I will tell you on my way down when I was by that,

[00:32:56] uh,

[00:32:56] sign in register,

[00:32:58] uh,

[00:32:59] just near the parking lot.

[00:33:01] I ran into Jim booting and Margaret McGrath.

[00:33:05] Uh,

[00:33:06] for those of you who don't know,

[00:33:07] but should know,

[00:33:08] Jim is the keeper of the canisters and probably just about anything and

[00:33:13] everything else.

[00:33:14] Catskills related.

[00:33:15] Yeah.

[00:33:17] So Jim and I were talking about many things.

[00:33:19] I don't know if you know Stosh,

[00:33:21] but Jim was on Wyndham the day after that plane crash.

[00:33:27] Oh,

[00:33:28] wow.

[00:33:28] Within like 18 hours.

[00:33:31] And he actually ran into,

[00:33:32] and was telling me about,

[00:33:35] uh,

[00:33:35] his talking to the two Rangers who found the plane and the deceased pilot.

[00:33:42] But I won't,

[00:33:43] I won't go into that story.

[00:33:44] Um,

[00:33:45] that's tough.

[00:33:46] Yeah.

[00:33:46] Yeah.

[00:33:46] It's a tough story.

[00:33:47] And he was,

[00:33:47] you know,

[00:33:48] he was giving me some details on that,

[00:33:49] but we had a,

[00:33:50] a long conversation was long enough that I kept looking over at Margaret and

[00:33:54] because of all the idle time,

[00:33:55] she started getting chilly and layering up.

[00:33:57] But Jim and I were having a good time chatting and chatting and chatting.

[00:34:01] And the one thing that I was just lying and wait for him to mention was the podcast.

[00:34:10] He didn't.

[00:34:11] And it's,

[00:34:11] well,

[00:34:12] it seemed like our conversation was winding down.

[00:34:14] And then he said to me,

[00:34:16] Oh,

[00:34:17] I see.

[00:34:17] I've been doing the podcast with Stosh.

[00:34:20] And so I just had,

[00:34:21] I was just waiting for that moment to segue in.

[00:34:24] I said,

[00:34:24] Oh yeah.

[00:34:24] You know,

[00:34:25] yada,

[00:34:25] yada,

[00:34:26] yada.

[00:34:26] And by the way,

[00:34:27] Jim,

[00:34:28] is it true that you won't even respond to Stosh when he asks you to get on this show?

[00:34:36] And he starts to say,

[00:34:37] yeah,

[00:34:37] yeah.

[00:34:38] I said,

[00:34:38] but I know Jim,

[00:34:38] you've got to,

[00:34:39] you've got to be aching to get on the show and relay just all of your knowledge of Catskill

[00:34:44] history,

[00:34:45] nuances,

[00:34:47] anything and everything.

[00:34:47] And he's like,

[00:34:48] yeah.

[00:34:49] He says,

[00:34:49] yeah,

[00:34:49] I'll come on.

[00:34:51] Nice.

[00:34:51] Yeah.

[00:34:52] I'll come on.

[00:34:52] So,

[00:34:53] and I,

[00:34:53] so I said,

[00:34:53] so I asked him,

[00:34:54] so why,

[00:34:54] why is it Stosh?

[00:34:56] You never responded.

[00:34:57] Or,

[00:34:58] uh,

[00:34:58] Jim,

[00:34:59] why is it?

[00:35:00] You never responded to Stosh,

[00:35:02] but here it is.

[00:35:03] I bump into you on the trail and you're agreeing to come on the show.

[00:35:07] And he says,

[00:35:08] well,

[00:35:08] it was the personal touch.

[00:35:09] Stosh never called me up and asked me.

[00:35:12] All so.

[00:35:13] So,

[00:35:14] so,

[00:35:14] so our people are going to get ahold of Jim.

[00:35:17] I don't even know his number.

[00:35:19] Well,

[00:35:20] you have an email for him.

[00:35:22] I do.

[00:35:23] And I talk,

[00:35:23] I get through him from Facebook and he responds to me quickly.

[00:35:25] Yeah.

[00:35:26] So let's reach out to him.

[00:35:27] He wants to do it in person.

[00:35:28] Cause he's not hooked up with all this fancy gear.

[00:35:31] Like Jamie has,

[00:35:32] you know,

[00:35:33] I think of all the guests we've had on so far,

[00:35:35] Jamie's got like this,

[00:35:36] you know,

[00:35:36] surround lighting and,

[00:35:38] you know,

[00:35:39] nice audio.

[00:35:39] Yeah.

[00:35:40] I'm envious.

[00:35:40] I'm checking out what he's got going on there.

[00:35:43] So in any way,

[00:35:44] like balsam highlight,

[00:35:45] the snow is deep,

[00:35:45] but then I went over after that.

[00:35:48] To fly and bear pen.

[00:35:50] And I don't know as if the snow was as deep.

[00:35:54] There is,

[00:35:54] uh,

[00:35:56] Jamie and Julie encountered on loan and Rocky.

[00:35:59] Uh,

[00:36:00] but it was,

[00:36:01] yeah,

[00:36:01] it was sweet.

[00:36:02] Just a ton of snow there.

[00:36:03] And it was lightly snowing when I got there.

[00:36:06] And then I got,

[00:36:06] I got run down by a hunter in one of those all terrain vehicles.

[00:36:10] I saw,

[00:36:11] I saw that picture.

[00:36:12] I was curious of what,

[00:36:13] what was going on there.

[00:36:15] Yeah.

[00:36:15] I think my wife sent the guy after me or something.

[00:36:19] Yeah.

[00:36:19] That's a,

[00:36:20] that's a,

[00:36:20] that's a tough place.

[00:36:21] Everybody's up there with,

[00:36:22] uh,

[00:36:22] snowmobiles and ATVs and stuff.

[00:36:25] You know,

[00:36:25] it's a,

[00:36:26] it's a tough place,

[00:36:26] but it's beautiful.

[00:36:27] I love bear pen.

[00:36:28] It's a fun one.

[00:36:29] I got a,

[00:36:30] you know,

[00:36:30] one of my,

[00:36:30] my projects.

[00:36:31] And I talked to this about Julie with Julie.

[00:36:33] Jamie is,

[00:36:34] uh,

[00:36:34] going back and kind of like retracing all the trails,

[00:36:38] all the runs that they had up on the Princeton ski bowl and see if we can,

[00:36:42] we can like GPS all the runs and stuff.

[00:36:45] I mean,

[00:36:45] I would do that in the summer.

[00:36:46] She would do that in the probably winter and stuff,

[00:36:48] but it looks to me like I I've been up there in the winter and you can see,

[00:36:52] you can see that little narrow spot of where one was,

[00:36:55] but I would never try to do that in,

[00:36:58] uh,

[00:36:59] in skiing because you just get whacked in the head.

[00:37:01] Maybe you guys are,

[00:37:02] you guys are,

[00:37:03] you guys are better at that.

[00:37:04] So you probably avoid it pretty well.

[00:37:06] So,

[00:37:06] yeah,

[00:37:07] there's,

[00:37:07] there's,

[00:37:08] yeah,

[00:37:08] it's grown in a lot there,

[00:37:09] but that would be super cool to do to figure out where they all were.

[00:37:12] Yeah.

[00:37:13] So cool.

[00:37:14] Everybody got up with me.

[00:37:15] Sorry.

[00:37:16] Sorry.

[00:37:17] Good conditions.

[00:37:18] Maybe this weekend will be the last true winter conditions out there for a

[00:37:23] while.

[00:37:23] Cause next week,

[00:37:24] the warmer temps and rain is rolling in.

[00:37:27] Oh,

[00:37:27] so it's going to change everything.

[00:37:30] Yeah.

[00:37:30] So we'll see.

[00:37:31] We'll see.

[00:37:32] You never know.

[00:37:32] New York always has surprises.

[00:37:34] So,

[00:37:35] uh,

[00:37:35] volunteer 3500 club,

[00:37:37] Catskill trail crew,

[00:37:38] Catskill mountains club,

[00:37:39] visitor center,

[00:37:39] jelly rover stroke crew,

[00:37:41] Brownlee mountain fire towers.

[00:37:42] Now up,

[00:37:42] uh,

[00:37:42] they're,

[00:37:43] they're not open,

[00:37:43] but they're up.

[00:37:44] So it's pretty cool.

[00:37:46] Volunteer for anybody and everybody can.

[00:37:47] It's,

[00:37:47] it's pretty much kind of closed right now.

[00:37:49] So don't forget to ask me about stickers and then go to camp.

[00:37:53] Catskill for stickers,

[00:37:54] free stickers.

[00:37:55] They're free.

[00:37:55] Just ask me,

[00:37:56] send me a message and I will send you one for free.

[00:37:59] All right.

[00:38:01] Yeah.

[00:38:01] So weather forecast this weekend.

[00:38:03] I'm looking,

[00:38:04] uh,

[00:38:05] up weather forecast,

[00:38:06] a mountain weather forecast and,

[00:38:08] uh,

[00:38:08] Friday,

[00:38:09] Saturday,

[00:38:09] and Sunday look to be pretty nice.

[00:38:11] Some clouds clear,

[00:38:13] mostly every day.

[00:38:14] Winds are going to be pretty high and it's going to be really chilly.

[00:38:17] So Friday,

[00:38:18] a high of 10 degrees,

[00:38:19] a low of negative 15 in the day,

[00:38:22] in the middle of the day,

[00:38:23] negative 15.

[00:38:24] That's my kind of weather.

[00:38:25] I love that stuff.

[00:38:27] Uh,

[00:38:27] Saturday,

[00:38:28] a high of later in the day,

[00:38:30] later in the evening is 27 and then a low of negative 11.

[00:38:34] So that'll be once again,

[00:38:35] wind is,

[00:38:35] is a factor up there.

[00:38:37] And then Sunday,

[00:38:38] when once the,

[00:38:38] like Tad said,

[00:38:39] we're getting out into the,

[00:38:40] the warmer it's getting to be,

[00:38:42] it's going to dramatic change up to 36 to 41 degrees and a low of 23.

[00:38:46] So once again,

[00:38:47] just New York state is full of fricking surprises.

[00:38:50] And,

[00:38:51] you know,

[00:38:52] Jamie,

[00:38:52] as Jamie knows skiing in the winter,

[00:38:54] it's just an absolute,

[00:38:55] can be an absolute shit show.

[00:38:58] Yeah.

[00:38:59] It's like,

[00:38:59] God damn it can.

[00:39:02] All right.

[00:39:03] So last set of sponsors,

[00:39:05] and then we'll get on to Jamie's interview.

[00:39:06] You know,

[00:39:07] 41 minutes.

[00:39:07] That's usually that's,

[00:39:08] that's,

[00:39:09] that's low for us.

[00:39:10] Usually an hour and a half into this.

[00:39:11] So,

[00:39:12] all right.

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[00:40:32] All right.

[00:40:32] So let's get on to the guests of the night.

[00:40:37] So tonight we have Jamie Kennard here,

[00:40:39] and he's going to talk about skiing the high peaks and not just the Catskills,

[00:40:42] but the Adirondack and plus about his big film variable that's coming out.

[00:40:46] When is that coming out,

[00:40:48] Jamie?

[00:40:49] It's sort of out.

[00:40:51] We kind of premiered it in Rochester a couple weeks ago,

[00:40:55] but it is screening in Lake Placid this weekend,

[00:41:02] which I'm sort of treating as the big premiere,

[00:41:04] because the film is about skiing in the Adirondacks.

[00:41:09] And I think seven of the eight,

[00:41:12] quote unquote,

[00:41:13] cast members of the film are also going to be there.

[00:41:16] Um, so yeah,

[00:41:18] I'm sort of treating this weekend in Lake Placid as kind of the big,

[00:41:21] big premiere.

[00:41:22] Nice.

[00:41:23] Nice.

[00:41:23] So we'll get on to variable a little bit later.

[00:41:26] Why don't you give us a short background about yourself?

[00:41:30] Um,

[00:41:30] sure.

[00:41:31] Um,

[00:41:32] I guess I'll just sort of go back to my roots in the Catskills.

[00:41:35] Um,

[00:41:35] my grandmother grew up on a farm outside of Calcoun.

[00:41:40] Um,

[00:41:41] so I kind of traced my roots back to the Western Catskills.

[00:41:45] Um,

[00:41:45] but I grew up in Western New York outside of Rochester.

[00:41:49] I went to college in Saratoga Springs,

[00:41:52] um,

[00:41:53] a little stint in Western Massachusetts and then down to New York City for a while.

[00:41:57] And then kind of made my way up to the Catskills in the mid 2000s,

[00:42:02] um,

[00:42:03] to the Woodstock area.

[00:42:04] And so I was a part-timer for about nine years and moved up here permanently in 2015 and opened a wine bar in Kingston down by the waterfront around that time.

[00:42:17] Um,

[00:42:18] um,

[00:42:18] and I'm still here.

[00:42:19] So I,

[00:42:20] I love it.

[00:42:21] Nice.

[00:42:22] That's,

[00:42:23] that's,

[00:42:23] I gotta admit,

[00:42:24] it's great to be all over the place.

[00:42:25] Rochester coming down here and going up the Adirondacks.

[00:42:27] You're all over New York state.

[00:42:28] Yeah.

[00:42:29] Yeah.

[00:42:30] And that's,

[00:42:30] that's awesome.

[00:42:31] Um,

[00:42:31] first things first,

[00:42:32] I gotta start this off with a bang,

[00:42:34] you know,

[00:42:34] with variable,

[00:42:35] you said ice lake rescue,

[00:42:37] like what happened there?

[00:42:39] Let's,

[00:42:39] let's get to people's attention really quick.

[00:42:41] And then we'll get into other stuff.

[00:42:44] I don't want to give too much away because it's sort of a,

[00:42:47] a turning point in the film.

[00:42:49] So if people are,

[00:42:51] um,

[00:42:51] have a chance to see the film,

[00:42:53] but I will say,

[00:42:54] um,

[00:42:55] during our,

[00:42:56] our time and in the skiing,

[00:42:58] the Adirondacks,

[00:42:59] and I'll just preface this by,

[00:43:00] when I say,

[00:43:01] we,

[00:43:01] I'm referring to,

[00:43:02] to my brother,

[00:43:03] uh,

[00:43:03] my younger brothers,

[00:43:04] three years younger.

[00:43:05] And I,

[00:43:06] um,

[00:43:07] we did,

[00:43:08] uh,

[00:43:08] all of our skiing in the Catskills and the Adirondacks together.

[00:43:11] More or less.

[00:43:12] We each had a few outings that were,

[00:43:14] were solo,

[00:43:15] but,

[00:43:15] um,

[00:43:16] but to your question,

[00:43:18] during one of our outings in the Adirondacks,

[00:43:21] um,

[00:43:22] there was an injury,

[00:43:24] um,

[00:43:25] basically at the farthest point of our day,

[00:43:28] we were,

[00:43:29] um,

[00:43:30] pretty far in eight or nine miles.

[00:43:31] And,

[00:43:32] and there was an injury that,

[00:43:34] um,

[00:43:35] made it difficult for someone to,

[00:43:39] to,

[00:43:39] uh,

[00:43:40] sort of maneuver on skiing.

[00:43:41] And,

[00:43:42] uh,

[00:43:42] we,

[00:43:42] we changed a plan and tried to get,

[00:43:46] uh,

[00:43:48] out of the mountains via,

[00:43:50] uh,

[00:43:51] Ausable Lake.

[00:43:52] Um,

[00:43:53] and it took us many hours to get down to the lake.

[00:43:56] And the lake,

[00:43:58] by the time we got down there,

[00:43:59] we could not tell if it was safely passable.

[00:44:02] Um,

[00:44:03] meaning that the ice conditions,

[00:44:04] uh,

[00:44:05] was questionable.

[00:44:07] Um,

[00:44:08] and I don't know if you guys have ever had to,

[00:44:12] to cross thin ice before.

[00:44:15] Um,

[00:44:15] but doing so under the cover of darkness is a terrifying thing when you're not sure if you're going to go through the ice.

[00:44:23] Um,

[00:44:24] so we did not,

[00:44:26] uh,

[00:44:27] proceed further.

[00:44:28] And,

[00:44:29] um,

[00:44:30] I,

[00:44:31] for the first time,

[00:44:32] uh,

[00:44:33] in my life,

[00:44:34] and hopefully the only time,

[00:44:35] um,

[00:44:35] um,

[00:44:36] ended up pressing the SOS button on a emergency beacon.

[00:44:41] And this was,

[00:44:42] uh,

[00:44:42] an older beacon that did not have any two way communication.

[00:44:46] So,

[00:44:47] um,

[00:44:48] and,

[00:44:49] uh,

[00:44:50] yeah,

[00:44:50] I,

[00:44:50] I pushed that button wondering if it was actually going to work and if anyone was going to show up and,

[00:44:56] um,

[00:44:57] they eventually did.

[00:44:58] And we got out of there.

[00:45:00] And we,

[00:45:01] we,

[00:45:01] we can hear about it all in the movie,

[00:45:03] right?

[00:45:03] It's in the movie.

[00:45:04] Yeah.

[00:45:05] Nice.

[00:45:05] Okay.

[00:45:05] It's in the movie.

[00:45:06] That's good enough.

[00:45:07] That's good enough.

[00:45:07] Leave it at that.

[00:45:08] Let them on the edge.

[00:45:09] Yeah.

[00:45:09] Uh,

[00:45:10] so what is this,

[00:45:11] uh,

[00:45:11] 5k everyday challenge?

[00:45:12] I hear you're doing that.

[00:45:13] That sounds a little crazy.

[00:45:15] Um,

[00:45:15] it's something that I,

[00:45:16] I had done somewhat recently.

[00:45:19] I'm not doing it anymore,

[00:45:21] but to,

[00:45:21] to back up a,

[00:45:23] uh,

[00:45:23] a little bit.

[00:45:25] Um,

[00:45:25] so when,

[00:45:26] when I moved up here,

[00:45:27] um,

[00:45:28] I moved up to the Catskills with,

[00:45:29] uh,

[00:45:30] with my,

[00:45:31] uh,

[00:45:32] with my wife,

[00:45:32] Tracy.

[00:45:33] Um,

[00:45:34] and we opened,

[00:45:35] uh,

[00:45:35] and we were in the wine bar in Kingston together.

[00:45:37] And in,

[00:45:39] um,

[00:45:40] um,

[00:45:40] um,

[00:45:40] the middle of 2019,

[00:45:41] she was diagnosed with stage four cancer.

[00:45:43] Um,

[00:45:45] and after,

[00:45:46] uh,

[00:45:46] super difficult two years,

[00:45:48] uh,

[00:45:49] battling cancer,

[00:45:50] Tracy lost,

[00:45:51] um,

[00:45:52] that battle,

[00:45:52] um,

[00:45:54] at the end of,

[00:45:55] um,

[00:45:56] 2021.

[00:45:57] And so a few months later when I held her memorial celebration,

[00:46:00] um,

[00:46:01] the day after that memorial,

[00:46:03] um,

[00:46:04] I sort of gave myself a personal challenge to start doing a 5k outside,

[00:46:11] um,

[00:46:13] every day.

[00:46:13] And it was just,

[00:46:14] I was going to do it for 30 days,

[00:46:16] just a month.

[00:46:16] And it was sort of a way for me to just keep myself motivated.

[00:46:22] And I think a lot of us who enjoy being in the mountains sort of thrive on being outside

[00:46:28] and what that brings to us.

[00:46:29] And it's different for everyone.

[00:46:30] But for me at that time in my life,

[00:46:33] I just knew I needed to move my body and I needed to be outside.

[00:46:37] And so I just said every day,

[00:46:38] I'm just going to go out and hike or run or ride a bike for 5k.

[00:46:43] And so I did that for a month and then I kept going and I did it for six months.

[00:46:48] And then I kept on going.

[00:46:50] I did it for a year.

[00:46:53] And when I got to a year,

[00:46:54] I said,

[00:46:55] I'm going to keep going.

[00:46:56] And I did it,

[00:46:56] ended up doing it for 500 days straight.

[00:46:58] And my stipulations were it had to be a minimum of five kilometers

[00:47:02] and it had to be outside.

[00:47:05] So it's not riding a Peloton or doing something indoors.

[00:47:09] So it doesn't matter if it's raining,

[00:47:11] hailing,

[00:47:11] snowing,

[00:47:12] sleeting.

[00:47:13] I had to go outside every day.

[00:47:15] And slowly those 5k's turned into five miles,

[00:47:19] 10 miles,

[00:47:20] 20 miles,

[00:47:21] 100 miles,

[00:47:22] depending on the activity.

[00:47:24] But I learned to become a runner.

[00:47:26] I started cycling.

[00:47:27] I did a three-day solo canoe trip.

[00:47:31] Obviously lots of backcountry skiing,

[00:47:33] human-powered skiing,

[00:47:35] surfing,

[00:47:36] paddling,

[00:47:37] all sorts of things.

[00:47:38] So yeah,

[00:47:39] it was a pretty amazing thing.

[00:47:42] And I finished day 500.

[00:47:45] I went out down to the Ashokan Rail Trail

[00:47:48] and I ran my first marathon solo,

[00:47:54] self-supported,

[00:47:56] ran the length of the Ashokan Rail Trail and back

[00:47:59] and added on some extra mileage to make it a full marathon.

[00:48:03] And that's how I finished day 500.

[00:48:07] And then I took a break.

[00:48:08] And before you move on,

[00:48:10] tell us about the school children

[00:48:11] at the end of that marathon run.

[00:48:14] The school children.

[00:48:16] The school children.

[00:48:17] That was sort of an amazing experience.

[00:48:20] I was,

[00:48:21] as I mentioned,

[00:48:22] I was doing the marathon self-supported.

[00:48:24] So I carried some water.

[00:48:25] I had intended to,

[00:48:27] there's a stewards on one end of the rail trail.

[00:48:30] And I thought,

[00:48:31] I'll just go to the stewards.

[00:48:32] If I run out of supplies,

[00:48:33] I'll go in the middle of this marathon

[00:48:34] and go and get some more water.

[00:48:37] But, you know,

[00:48:38] when I was in the middle of running this marathon,

[00:48:40] like most runners,

[00:48:41] at some point,

[00:48:42] you probably just get in the zone.

[00:48:45] And I thought,

[00:48:46] like,

[00:48:46] what a terrible thing

[00:48:47] to have to stop

[00:48:48] and walk into a stewards right now.

[00:48:50] And so I just decided

[00:48:51] I was going to stay in the zone

[00:48:53] and keep running,

[00:48:54] which meant I ran out of water

[00:48:57] around mile 20 or 21

[00:49:00] of doing this.

[00:49:01] But I kept on going.

[00:49:02] And as I was sort of feeling a little down

[00:49:05] and dejected

[00:49:07] and just physically depleted,

[00:49:09] I came across

[00:49:10] what probably was a couple classes worth

[00:49:12] of young students

[00:49:14] that were out with their teachers

[00:49:15] on the rail trail,

[00:49:17] I guess on probably a science trip.

[00:49:19] And as I came running down the rail trail,

[00:49:23] the students parted

[00:49:24] almost like the Red Sea.

[00:49:25] They just lined either side.

[00:49:28] And I thought like being kids,

[00:49:30] they were just going to like snicker,

[00:49:32] make fun of me as I ran by.

[00:49:34] They just looked at me

[00:49:35] and they all started cheering

[00:49:37] as I ran through them.

[00:49:38] And probably it was 100 kids.

[00:49:40] And I had maybe a mile,

[00:49:42] a mile and a half left.

[00:49:43] And, you know,

[00:49:44] this was sort of a,

[00:49:45] I knew this is a,

[00:49:46] you know,

[00:49:47] a really important ending

[00:49:48] to my 500 day journey.

[00:49:51] And these kids had no idea.

[00:49:52] And it was such,

[00:49:54] it was such a huge boost

[00:49:57] and just,

[00:49:58] I don't know,

[00:49:59] just,

[00:49:59] you know,

[00:50:00] an amazing moment.

[00:50:02] I think I probably

[00:50:03] started tearing up

[00:50:05] as I passed through them

[00:50:06] and they were all cheering

[00:50:08] and clapping.

[00:50:09] That's phenomenal.

[00:50:10] Yeah.

[00:50:10] I credit those kids

[00:50:11] for getting me

[00:50:11] into the finish line that day.

[00:50:13] Yeah.

[00:50:14] Pretty special moment.

[00:50:15] Very cool.

[00:50:16] Yeah.

[00:50:16] So do you have,

[00:50:17] I know,

[00:50:18] I don't know,

[00:50:18] I didn't ask this before.

[00:50:19] Do you know of any stats

[00:50:20] that you have for that 5k,

[00:50:22] like total end stats

[00:50:23] of those 500 days

[00:50:25] that you did that?

[00:50:26] Can you take a guess?

[00:50:28] Had them all.

[00:50:29] You know,

[00:50:30] I think I'd have to look back on,

[00:50:32] I think I posted something

[00:50:33] on Instagram around the time.

[00:50:35] Well,

[00:50:36] maybe around the year mark.

[00:50:37] I think I had tallied up

[00:50:38] everything from Strava.

[00:50:41] And yeah,

[00:50:42] it was a lot.

[00:50:44] Yeah,

[00:50:45] it was a lot,

[00:50:46] but it was fun

[00:50:46] to just look back

[00:50:48] and,

[00:50:49] you know,

[00:50:49] if anyone uses Strava,

[00:50:50] you can kind of look back

[00:50:51] and you can pull up a calendar

[00:50:53] and just every single day

[00:50:54] you could scroll through,

[00:50:56] just had a dot

[00:50:56] for different levels

[00:50:58] of activity in there.

[00:51:00] Yeah.

[00:51:00] I don't know.

[00:51:01] It was,

[00:51:01] it was,

[00:51:02] it was a lot,

[00:51:03] but,

[00:51:04] but I learned

[00:51:05] that I really craved

[00:51:07] just that time outside

[00:51:09] and I hated running

[00:51:11] my entire life.

[00:51:12] I was never a runner.

[00:51:13] I had never run

[00:51:14] more than a 5k

[00:51:15] prior to this.

[00:51:17] And now I probably run

[00:51:20] three times a week.

[00:51:22] I probably go out

[00:51:22] and run five to seven miles,

[00:51:24] you know,

[00:51:25] three or four times a week

[00:51:26] and,

[00:51:28] among other things.

[00:51:29] And yeah,

[00:51:30] it just really,

[00:51:30] it really opened,

[00:51:32] really opened my eyes

[00:51:33] to just loving the outdoors

[00:51:36] more in different ways.

[00:51:37] And I just,

[00:51:38] I really crave it.

[00:51:39] Like,

[00:51:40] I didn't,

[00:51:40] you know,

[00:51:40] I know a lot of your listeners

[00:51:41] really crave being outdoors,

[00:51:43] but for me,

[00:51:44] it was just,

[00:51:45] it was just,

[00:51:47] you know,

[00:51:48] a huge emotional

[00:51:51] support for me

[00:51:52] to get outside

[00:51:53] and either clear my head

[00:51:55] or to just absorb

[00:51:56] what was outside.

[00:51:57] Yeah,

[00:51:58] I love it.

[00:52:00] Amazing.

[00:52:01] So,

[00:52:01] let's get into the skiing,

[00:52:02] the high peaks

[00:52:03] of the Catskills.

[00:52:04] So,

[00:52:05] you did this back when?

[00:52:08] Um,

[00:52:08] so I was just looking back

[00:52:09] at my tally sheet.

[00:52:11] I skied my first peak

[00:52:13] at the very end of 2012.

[00:52:15] Um,

[00:52:17] and my brother and I finished,

[00:52:20] uh,

[00:52:22] March 10th of 2014.

[00:52:24] So,

[00:52:26] I guess technically three years,

[00:52:28] but really two winters.

[00:52:29] Yeah.

[00:52:30] So,

[00:52:31] are you the first to do that?

[00:52:33] You were you the first,

[00:52:33] you were the,

[00:52:34] we were,

[00:52:35] we were,

[00:52:35] we were the first.

[00:52:36] Yeah.

[00:52:36] As far,

[00:52:36] as far as we,

[00:52:37] we know,

[00:52:38] and I guess as far as the record

[00:52:39] keepers know,

[00:52:40] um,

[00:52:41] we were the first to do it.

[00:52:42] Um,

[00:52:43] certainly people had been skiing

[00:52:45] some of the,

[00:52:47] the high peaks out there

[00:52:48] long before us,

[00:52:49] but the easier ones though,

[00:52:51] I have to think that maybe,

[00:52:52] maybe a couple of them were,

[00:52:54] you know,

[00:52:55] first to sense,

[00:52:56] but you know,

[00:52:56] I,

[00:52:56] I have no way,

[00:52:57] no way of knowing,

[00:52:58] but,

[00:52:59] um,

[00:52:59] but yeah,

[00:53:00] I,

[00:53:00] I think,

[00:53:00] you know,

[00:53:01] we were the first to,

[00:53:02] to go out and ski them all.

[00:53:04] Yeah.

[00:53:04] All of that,

[00:53:04] the classic 35 at the time,

[00:53:06] you could still,

[00:53:07] you could still access all 35 peaks.

[00:53:09] So is there a patch for that?

[00:53:11] Everybody wants to know,

[00:53:12] is there a patch?

[00:53:12] Everybody wants the patch.

[00:53:14] You know,

[00:53:14] there's no patch that I know,

[00:53:17] but I couldn't find it.

[00:53:19] Um,

[00:53:20] I wish I could,

[00:53:21] it's probably out in my office,

[00:53:22] my studio,

[00:53:23] but the 3500 club did award Doug and I ski certificates,

[00:53:30] number one and two.

[00:53:33] Um,

[00:53:34] nice.

[00:53:34] It's super cool.

[00:53:35] And we were not expecting that when we went to the dinner,

[00:53:39] um,

[00:53:40] to be acknowledged.

[00:53:41] But,

[00:53:42] um,

[00:53:42] so we do have certificates,

[00:53:44] number one and two.

[00:53:44] Um,

[00:53:45] I think if Julie has anything to say about it,

[00:53:47] they'll have to,

[00:53:49] uh,

[00:53:49] make a patch.

[00:53:50] Um,

[00:53:50] I know she's expecting to get certificate number three.

[00:53:53] Um,

[00:53:54] but,

[00:53:55] um,

[00:53:55] yeah,

[00:53:55] maybe there will be a patch.

[00:53:56] I know I've seen a couple of people in the message boards this year that are starting

[00:54:00] their ski quest as well.

[00:54:02] So,

[00:54:02] um,

[00:54:03] there's,

[00:54:03] there's more people out there going after it now.

[00:54:06] I don't,

[00:54:07] I don't know.

[00:54:07] There's the patch.

[00:54:08] It's all about the patch.

[00:54:09] That's what you got.

[00:54:11] I mean,

[00:54:11] that's what it's all about.

[00:54:12] Yeah.

[00:54:13] So it's talking about skiing,

[00:54:15] the high peaks and stuff like that.

[00:54:16] So let's get into your film variable.

[00:54:18] Uh,

[00:54:18] you want to talk about that real quick?

[00:54:20] What is it about,

[00:54:21] uh,

[00:54:22] stuff,

[00:54:23] uh,

[00:54:23] such like that?

[00:54:24] Yeah.

[00:54:25] Um,

[00:54:26] so variable is a documentary film that,

[00:54:30] um,

[00:54:30] um,

[00:54:30] I guess just came out,

[00:54:32] um,

[00:54:33] premiered in Rochester,

[00:54:34] uh,

[00:54:35] two weeks ago.

[00:54:36] Um,

[00:54:36] it's a documentary film that I made,

[00:54:39] um,

[00:54:40] about,

[00:54:41] uh,

[00:54:42] skiing the Adirondack 46ers.

[00:54:45] It sort of touches on that,

[00:54:47] the Catskill,

[00:54:47] um,

[00:54:48] part,

[00:54:49] uh,

[00:54:49] in the backstory,

[00:54:50] but the,

[00:54:51] the film's journey is mostly focused on,

[00:54:55] um,

[00:54:55] the last 10 years that Doug and I spent skiing in the Adirondack.

[00:55:00] Um,

[00:55:02] and,

[00:55:03] you know,

[00:55:03] I hadn't intended,

[00:55:06] most of our time up there,

[00:55:08] I had no intentions at all of making a documentary film.

[00:55:12] It wasn't in my wheelhouse at all.

[00:55:15] Um,

[00:55:15] um,

[00:55:16] after my wife passed away,

[00:55:18] um,

[00:55:19] in 2022,

[00:55:21] I decided that,

[00:55:23] um,

[00:55:24] um,

[00:55:24] I wanted to sort of take a left or a right turn or some sort of turn with my life

[00:55:29] and try to start making documentary films.

[00:55:33] Um,

[00:55:34] and so I bought a camera,

[00:55:36] kind of spent that first year teaching myself as much as I could learn about filmmaking

[00:55:44] and made a couple very short films in 2022 and 2023.

[00:55:49] Um,

[00:55:50] and when I say short,

[00:55:51] I call them vignettes.

[00:55:52] They're like three,

[00:55:53] four minute long films,

[00:55:55] um,

[00:55:55] just to get my feet wet.

[00:55:57] And yeah,

[00:55:58] so variable,

[00:56:00] the,

[00:56:01] you know,

[00:56:01] when Doug and I were skiing the Adirondacks,

[00:56:03] we'd been sort of just recording things on GoPros and our phones just for posterity.

[00:56:08] Um,

[00:56:09] so we had lots of footage and photos to look back on,

[00:56:13] but it wasn't really until this past year,

[00:56:16] um,

[00:56:17] when I decided that I wanted to try to,

[00:56:19] um,

[00:56:20] sort of crystallize all of that and to attempt to make a documentary film about it.

[00:56:26] So,

[00:56:27] um,

[00:56:27] I was a little bit more conscious of it this past year when we were skiing the peaks.

[00:56:32] And then this past summer,

[00:56:33] I spent some time traveling around the Northeast,

[00:56:36] interviewing a few folks for the film.

[00:56:39] And then I've spent,

[00:56:40] um,

[00:56:40] the latter half of the summer and early this fall,

[00:56:43] just sitting in a chair and editing and pulling everything together.

[00:56:46] But,

[00:56:47] um,

[00:56:47] yeah,

[00:56:48] it's a lot to,

[00:56:48] to go back through 10 years of,

[00:56:51] of footage and try to,

[00:56:52] um,

[00:56:53] pull it all together in a,

[00:56:55] you know,

[00:56:55] in a 30 minute film.

[00:56:57] Um,

[00:56:58] so,

[00:56:58] but that's,

[00:56:58] that's what,

[00:56:59] uh,

[00:57:00] variable is about.

[00:57:01] So Jamie,

[00:57:03] where would one of our listeners go to see variable?

[00:57:06] Or how do they go about watching it?

[00:57:09] Yeah.

[00:57:10] So variable is going to be screening in Woodstock next week,

[00:57:14] but that screening sold out in about 48 hours.

[00:57:20] And so,

[00:57:21] wow,

[00:57:21] nice.

[00:57:22] Um,

[00:57:22] so there are no tickets available for,

[00:57:25] for purchase for that.

[00:57:28] But next month,

[00:57:30] as far as local folks go,

[00:57:31] uh,

[00:57:32] it is going to be screening,

[00:57:34] um,

[00:57:34] in New Paltz at rock and snow,

[00:57:38] which is an amazing store down there.

[00:57:40] And that is going to be on,

[00:57:42] uh,

[00:57:43] uh,

[00:57:43] January 11th.

[00:57:44] That'll be a free screening in the evening.

[00:57:47] And then two weeks later,

[00:57:50] January 23rd,

[00:57:52] it will be screening,

[00:57:53] uh,

[00:57:54] at,

[00:57:54] in Hunter,

[00:57:55] New York,

[00:57:56] um,

[00:57:56] at the Catskill Mountain Foundation at the Mountain Cinema.

[00:58:00] And,

[00:58:01] um,

[00:58:02] you know,

[00:58:02] I'm trying to work on maybe a couple more local dates,

[00:58:05] but,

[00:58:06] um,

[00:58:07] there is website for the movie.

[00:58:09] It's variable movie.com.

[00:58:11] And so whatever screenings I have around the Northeast and any local screenings,

[00:58:16] the latest information will be,

[00:58:18] will be posted there.

[00:58:20] You're all over the place with this,

[00:58:22] right?

[00:58:22] I know you're like New Hampshire and stuff like that.

[00:58:24] Yeah.

[00:58:25] It's,

[00:58:25] um,

[00:58:26] I'm sort of,

[00:58:27] you know,

[00:58:27] I'm kind of going back to my,

[00:58:28] my punk rock band days.

[00:58:30] When I was in college,

[00:58:31] I took a semester off and booked a tour for my band and we spent a summer,

[00:58:35] you know,

[00:58:36] doing the whole van thing,

[00:58:37] driving around the country.

[00:58:38] And I'm back to those roots right now.

[00:58:42] I'm,

[00:58:42] I'm booking a film tour.

[00:58:44] I'm going to get in my,

[00:58:45] in my car and drive around the Northeast winter,

[00:58:49] the Northeast this winter.

[00:58:50] So yeah,

[00:58:50] uh,

[00:58:51] it's screening up in Lake Placid this weekend,

[00:58:54] the Mountaineer,

[00:58:55] um,

[00:58:55] which is an amazing store in Keene Valley.

[00:58:58] They do a big kickoff ski season,

[00:59:01] back country ski season kickoff,

[00:59:03] um,

[00:59:04] every December.

[00:59:05] Um,

[00:59:05] and so they're hosting a film night and,

[00:59:08] um,

[00:59:09] have other speakers at the North country school this Saturday.

[00:59:12] So,

[00:59:13] um,

[00:59:13] that'll be a big screening up there.

[00:59:15] Um,

[00:59:15] I'm taking it to Burlington next Thursday at J skis up in Burlington.

[00:59:20] Um,

[00:59:21] I'll be at bright ideas brewing on the mass mocha campus and North Adams,

[00:59:26] uh,

[00:59:27] next Friday,

[00:59:28] December 13th.

[00:59:29] And then back here in Woodstock on the 14th.

[00:59:32] And then a couple of days later,

[00:59:33] I am traveling down to Brooklyn,

[00:59:36] uh,

[00:59:37] to Nighthawk cinema.

[00:59:39] Um,

[00:59:40] and there's,

[00:59:41] uh,

[00:59:41] I think it's maybe the first annual,

[00:59:43] uh,

[00:59:44] it's called New York ski.

[00:59:45] Um,

[00:59:46] some folks are putting together as sort of ski and snowboard documentary,

[00:59:51] short film night,

[00:59:53] um,

[00:59:54] at Nighthawk cinema.

[00:59:55] And this is the first year they're doing it.

[00:59:56] And they asked me to be a part of it.

[00:59:58] So I'll be in Brooklyn,

[01:00:00] um,

[01:00:00] just Thursday,

[01:00:01] December 19th.

[01:00:02] Yeah.

[01:00:02] And then,

[01:00:03] you know,

[01:00:04] the local dates next month,

[01:00:05] um,

[01:00:06] working on a date for Saratoga Springs up at Skidmore college and then taking it up

[01:00:11] to New Hampshire.

[01:00:12] Um,

[01:00:12] there's a big back country ski weekend up there and I'll be screening the film on

[01:00:19] Friday night on the opening night of the festival weekend.

[01:00:23] Um,

[01:00:23] so yeah,

[01:00:24] I'm just excited to bring the film around to as many places as I can in the

[01:00:28] Northeast and might even,

[01:00:31] and be taking it out to Boulder,

[01:00:32] um,

[01:00:33] for screening in January as well.

[01:00:34] So,

[01:00:35] um,

[01:00:36] yeah,

[01:00:36] I'm,

[01:00:36] you know,

[01:00:37] wherever this film is screening this winter,

[01:00:38] I'm traveling around.

[01:00:40] Um,

[01:00:41] and some of the screenings,

[01:00:43] like the screening in,

[01:00:44] uh,

[01:00:45] New Paltz and Hunter,

[01:00:46] I'm also doing a talk before the screening.

[01:00:50] So a little bit more of a kind of an extended presentation.

[01:00:53] Um,

[01:00:54] so yeah,

[01:00:55] I'm just,

[01:00:55] I'm traveling around doing my thing.

[01:00:58] So talking about doing your thing,

[01:01:00] Jamie,

[01:01:01] tell us about,

[01:01:02] uh,

[01:01:02] skiing,

[01:01:03] your background in skiing.

[01:01:04] When you started skiing,

[01:01:05] the type of skiing you did,

[01:01:07] where you did it,

[01:01:07] give us the,

[01:01:08] the detail on that.

[01:01:10] Yeah.

[01:01:10] I,

[01:01:11] um,

[01:01:12] so I grew up skiing in Western New York,

[01:01:14] um,

[01:01:14] at Bristol mountain,

[01:01:15] um,

[01:01:16] started ski racing right around junior high.

[01:01:19] Um,

[01:01:21] uh,

[01:01:21] so I,

[01:01:21] I ski raced as well as my brother,

[01:01:23] Doug,

[01:01:24] um,

[01:01:24] through junior high and high school.

[01:01:27] And.

[01:01:28] No,

[01:01:29] for the,

[01:01:29] for the,

[01:01:30] for the listeners,

[01:01:30] what is ski race?

[01:01:31] I have,

[01:01:31] I have no clue.

[01:01:32] I'm not,

[01:01:33] I'm not here.

[01:01:34] Yeah.

[01:01:34] Um,

[01:01:35] yeah,

[01:01:35] it's,

[01:01:36] you know,

[01:01:36] people have heard of Lindsay Vaughn or Michaela Schifrin.

[01:01:39] And they're sort of,

[01:01:39] um,

[01:01:40] two very famous sort of,

[01:01:42] um,

[01:01:42] current ski racers,

[01:01:44] but yeah,

[01:01:44] giant slalom,

[01:01:46] slalom,

[01:01:47] downhill,

[01:01:48] super G.

[01:01:49] Um,

[01:01:50] yeah,

[01:01:50] just alpine ski racing.

[01:01:52] So,

[01:01:52] so I spent,

[01:01:53] yeah,

[01:01:54] that's,

[01:01:54] those are my weekends traveling around Western New York and then,

[01:01:57] you know,

[01:01:57] up to the empire state games and like Placid,

[01:02:00] um,

[01:02:01] later in the winter.

[01:02:02] Um,

[01:02:03] I went on to race for Skidmore college and Saratoga Springs.

[01:02:06] So yeah,

[01:02:08] I,

[01:02:08] you know,

[01:02:08] ski racing was kind of my winter activity through college,

[01:02:13] but,

[01:02:14] you know,

[01:02:15] post college,

[01:02:16] um,

[01:02:17] when I didn't have competitive ski racing anymore,

[01:02:20] um,

[01:02:20] I just,

[01:02:22] I,

[01:02:23] part of me was missing a challenge in skiing and I just wasn't as happy skiing,

[01:02:31] you know,

[01:02:31] riding the lifts and just skiing the same runs over and over again,

[01:02:35] wherever I was.

[01:02:36] Um,

[01:02:37] so I,

[01:02:38] I,

[01:02:38] I started to get a little bit bored with it.

[01:02:40] And at one point I switched over to snowboarding cause I just,

[01:02:44] you know,

[01:02:45] I grew up skateboarding and,

[01:02:46] um,

[01:02:47] um,

[01:02:47] I just never had the chance to spend time snowboarding when I was younger cause I was,

[01:02:51] I was,

[01:02:51] I was,

[01:02:52] I was,

[01:02:53] I was just bored with skiing and I switched over to snowboarding just to learn something

[01:02:55] new.

[01:02:56] So I,

[01:02:56] I started to do that for a couple of years,

[01:02:58] but as this idea of backcountry skiing was starting to percolate,

[01:03:02] I decided to kind of switch back over to skiing and,

[01:03:06] and then sort of made my way into the backcountry ski world and started learning about that and,

[01:03:12] and dabbling in that.

[01:03:14] And that sort of kind of started to reignite my interest or my love for skiing again.

[01:03:19] Um,

[01:03:20] which just,

[01:03:21] you know,

[01:03:22] I had really just kind of gone dormant.

[01:03:25] And I just,

[01:03:25] you know,

[01:03:26] I was,

[01:03:26] I feel like there was a winter or two where I might've only skied once cause I just was not excited about it.

[01:03:31] So,

[01:03:32] so Ted's gonna ask all these questions cause that's a prolific skier.

[01:03:36] He's been skiing for a while.

[01:03:38] I have no clue about skiing.

[01:03:39] I did a little,

[01:03:40] I did a little bit of snowboarding,

[01:03:42] but I didn't do any skiing.

[01:03:43] So take it away.

[01:03:45] Just,

[01:03:46] just for reference,

[01:03:47] Jamie,

[01:03:47] I,

[01:03:47] I grew up skiing in Western New York.

[01:03:49] Oh,

[01:03:50] amazing.

[01:03:51] So,

[01:03:51] yeah.

[01:03:51] So places like cocaine holiday Valley.

[01:03:54] Yeah.

[01:03:55] I've skied Bristol,

[01:03:56] Swain wing hollow.

[01:03:58] You remember a place called wing hollow?

[01:04:00] Well,

[01:04:00] there's Swain and there's hunt hollow.

[01:04:02] So maybe you're combining the two.

[01:04:04] No,

[01:04:04] the wing hollow was outside of Olean,

[01:04:07] New York.

[01:04:08] Oh,

[01:04:08] never skied.

[01:04:09] Yeah.

[01:04:09] Never heard of it.

[01:04:10] So it's,

[01:04:10] it's known for the mysterious skiing,

[01:04:14] new year's Eve,

[01:04:15] 19,

[01:04:16] whatever it was.

[01:04:18] Yeah.

[01:04:18] That was,

[01:04:19] yeah.

[01:04:19] So they have skiing places out,

[01:04:21] out in the Western part of the thing.

[01:04:23] How was it like that?

[01:04:24] What are the runs like 200?

[01:04:25] We grow up.

[01:04:26] I think Jamie can agree with me.

[01:04:27] I don't know when he grew up,

[01:04:28] but it was after I did out in Western New York,

[01:04:31] but we used to get snowfall by,

[01:04:33] you know,

[01:04:34] seasonally over 300 inches.

[01:04:36] It was insane.

[01:04:38] The,

[01:04:38] the lake affects snow.

[01:04:39] I mean,

[01:04:39] what they're getting out there now is extreme,

[01:04:42] but we used to,

[01:04:43] every week we would get feet of snow.

[01:04:46] Yeah.

[01:04:47] The vertical runs,

[01:04:48] like the runs,

[01:04:49] like how.

[01:04:50] Yeah.

[01:04:50] We didn't have the vertical,

[01:04:51] but we had the snow.

[01:04:53] And so what I did is when Jamie got bored of skiing and it kind of like faded off after his racing days were over.

[01:05:00] I,

[01:05:01] I grew up waste racing in Western New York and really throughout New York state.

[01:05:05] And when I went off to college,

[01:05:06] I just started skiing in the Rockies all the time.

[01:05:10] Smart.

[01:05:11] You know,

[01:05:11] having fun out there.

[01:05:12] There is a tiny ski run called Brantling,

[01:05:16] which wasn't too far from me.

[01:05:18] It's so,

[01:05:18] I mean,

[01:05:19] it only has rope toes.

[01:05:21] It's so small.

[01:05:22] It just has a regular road that runs across the top of the,

[01:05:27] the ski hill,

[01:05:29] but because it's so small and the kids that grew up ski racing,

[01:05:34] there can get so many runs and they're literally just skiing,

[01:05:38] skiing,

[01:05:38] skiing,

[01:05:39] skiing.

[01:05:39] It produced,

[01:05:40] um,

[01:05:41] Diane Roth,

[01:05:42] who went on to be on the U S ski team.

[01:05:44] It just produced amazing skiers.

[01:05:46] Um,

[01:05:47] you know,

[01:05:47] and a lot of amazing,

[01:05:49] uh,

[01:05:50] skiers that are on the U S ski team now grew up on little Hills out in Michigan.

[01:05:52] And these little Hills that you just get so much repetition and,

[01:05:57] um,

[01:05:58] you just really learn how to,

[01:05:59] how to ski at them.

[01:06:00] You're not sitting on a lift half the time.

[01:06:02] You're just,

[01:06:02] you're spending all your time skiing.

[01:06:05] Um,

[01:06:05] so totally,

[01:06:06] totally agree with that.

[01:06:07] Yeah.

[01:06:08] So why don't,

[01:06:08] before we do the,

[01:06:09] the deep dive into back country skiing,

[01:06:12] why don't you just compare and contrast,

[01:06:14] if you would,

[01:06:15] the Alpine skiing you did growing up to,

[01:06:17] uh,

[01:06:18] your traditional Nordic cross country skiing,

[01:06:21] and then how those two things are different from the back country skiing that you do.

[01:06:28] I mean,

[01:06:29] I think,

[01:06:29] you know,

[01:06:29] Alpine skiing is,

[01:06:31] you know,

[01:06:31] what most people know and think of,

[01:06:33] you know,

[01:06:33] it's sort of heavy boots and bindings and you clip in,

[01:06:37] you ride on a lift and you ski down the hill.

[01:06:40] And then there's Nordic skiing,

[01:06:42] which,

[01:06:42] which I also do,

[01:06:43] which is,

[01:06:44] you know,

[01:06:44] more or less on flat ground.

[01:06:46] And you've got lighter boots and skinnier skis and your,

[01:06:50] the,

[01:06:50] your heel isn't locked in.

[01:06:52] So you're,

[01:06:52] you're sort of gliding along and,

[01:06:55] um,

[01:06:56] pushing yourself.

[01:06:57] It's much more human powered.

[01:06:59] And then back country skiing is more or less kind of a combination of the two.

[01:07:05] We,

[01:07:06] we refer to it as Alpine touring or for short AT skiing.

[01:07:11] And so the sort of modern version of it and the kind of equipment that my brother and I use has typically,

[01:07:21] you know,

[01:07:21] it's light.

[01:07:22] It looks like a downhill ski from afar,

[01:07:24] but the skis,

[01:07:26] um,

[01:07:26] are probably on the lighter side,

[01:07:28] at least ours are.

[01:07:29] So they're a little bit skinnier.

[01:07:30] The bindings are what we refer to as pin bindings.

[01:07:34] And so even though our ski boot sort of looks like a traditional downhill or Alpine ski boot,

[01:07:41] we have little divots up near the toe and the,

[01:07:44] the binding sort of has these pinchers on the side that clamp in.

[01:07:49] And so for part of our,

[01:07:50] um,

[01:07:51] ski touring or back country skiing,

[01:07:54] the heel of our,

[01:07:56] uh,

[01:07:57] ski boot is not locked in.

[01:07:59] So our boot is pivoting like a cross country or Nordic ski,

[01:08:04] but when we get to the top of the mountain,

[01:08:06] the back binding,

[01:08:09] um,

[01:08:09] can be adjusted or swiveled around and two pins will then connect into the back of your ski boot.

[01:08:16] They kind of shoot into some holes into the back of your ski boot and locks you in.

[01:08:20] And that essentially kind of puts you in downhill or Alpine,

[01:08:23] um,

[01:08:24] ski mode.

[01:08:25] So,

[01:08:25] um,

[01:08:26] so yeah,

[01:08:27] this back country gears,

[01:08:28] a little bit of a combination of,

[01:08:30] of both Nordic and Alpine ski world.

[01:08:33] And then,

[01:08:34] you know,

[01:08:34] the one added,

[01:08:35] um,

[01:08:36] thing that we are using on the bottoms of our skis,

[01:08:39] um,

[01:08:39] are what are called skins.

[01:08:41] And so,

[01:08:42] you know,

[01:08:43] hundreds of years ago,

[01:08:44] skins were actually made from animal hide.

[01:08:47] It could be from a fawn or a seal skin.

[01:08:50] Um,

[01:08:51] but they were attaching these hides to the bottom of a ski with the fur side down.

[01:08:56] And as the ski would slide forward,

[01:09:00] the fur would sort of slide in one direction.

[01:09:03] But if the ski slid backwards,

[01:09:06] the fibers or the,

[01:09:07] the hairs of that hide would sort of catch and grip the snow.

[01:09:12] And so these days they make a synthetic version of that.

[01:09:16] Um,

[01:09:17] and sort of the bottom of the skins feel plush and the plush side hits the snow.

[01:09:22] And then there's a sticky glue that sort of sticks to this underside of your ski.

[01:09:27] And there's little metal clips on the tips and the tail that kind of help keep it secure.

[01:09:31] And so when we're skiing up a mountain where we have these skins attached to our skis.

[01:09:37] And when we get to the top,

[01:09:38] we sort of peel them off,

[01:09:40] uh,

[01:09:41] roll them up,

[01:09:41] stick them in our jacket or in our backpack,

[01:09:44] adjust our bindings,

[01:09:45] buckle our boots.

[01:09:46] And then we are kind of,

[01:09:48] uh,

[01:09:48] in downhill mode.

[01:09:49] So,

[01:09:50] but we've got skis on our feet the whole time as we're ascending and descending.

[01:09:54] And then when you're in the downhill mode,

[01:09:56] your heels are locked onto the top of the ski.

[01:10:00] They're not lifting off it as you are.

[01:10:03] Our heels are locked.

[01:10:04] Yeah.

[01:10:04] And you know,

[01:10:05] there's,

[01:10:05] there's telemark skiing,

[01:10:06] um,

[01:10:07] which some people are familiar with,

[01:10:08] uh,

[01:10:09] similar idea,

[01:10:10] but that is also referred to as free heels skiing.

[01:10:14] Um,

[01:10:15] and with telemark skis,

[01:10:16] your heel is always free.

[01:10:18] Um,

[01:10:19] but you can do the same thing with telemark skis.

[01:10:21] You can put skins on them.

[01:10:23] You can ski up and you can ski down.

[01:10:24] It just so happens.

[01:10:25] What we're doing is called,

[01:10:26] uh,

[01:10:27] we're sort of using a Alpine version.

[01:10:29] Um,

[01:10:30] so we are locking our,

[01:10:31] our heels in for the descent.

[01:10:33] Before I hand it back to Stosh to two quick technical questions.

[01:10:37] Yeah.

[01:10:37] Seeing I have the technical end of the story tonight.

[01:10:42] When you get to some rolling terrain,

[01:10:43] are you taking the skins on and off?

[01:10:46] As you go up and down.

[01:10:48] It's funny,

[01:10:48] you know,

[01:10:48] when Doug and I,

[01:10:49] um,

[01:10:50] when we're skiing these mountains for the first time,

[01:10:53] as we're skiing out,

[01:10:55] we're always making mental notes and talking to each other.

[01:10:59] And we're saying,

[01:11:00] okay,

[01:11:00] when we ski back down,

[01:11:03] here's where we're probably going to stop and put our ski,

[01:11:05] our skins back on,

[01:11:07] because we're going to get to that rolling terrain.

[01:11:09] And if we don't have the skins on our skis,

[01:11:11] it's just harder because we're,

[01:11:13] we end up having to push more and do more work.

[01:11:16] So yeah.

[01:11:17] So sometimes,

[01:11:18] yeah,

[01:11:18] we are making that calculation about when are we getting off the steep stuff?

[01:11:22] And when are we going to need those skins on our skis?

[01:11:25] And when are we going to transition back to having our heel free again,

[01:11:28] and kind of getting more of that Nordic cross country mode?

[01:11:32] Sometimes we don't,

[01:11:33] you know,

[01:11:33] sometimes we take a guess and then we miscalculate something and we might have

[01:11:37] to switch again,

[01:11:38] but,

[01:11:39] but yes,

[01:11:40] we are thinking about that.

[01:11:41] So the heel lock are for the steeper stuff.

[01:11:44] And then the,

[01:11:47] the heel lock is for the steeper stuff.

[01:11:49] And when you get to flat terrain or something that's rolling a little bit more

[01:11:54] sort of up and down or gradual or forgiving,

[01:11:57] you,

[01:11:57] you,

[01:11:57] you generally want to have your heel unlocked and have skins on,

[01:12:02] on the bottoms of your skin.

[01:12:04] Okay.

[01:12:05] Once again,

[01:12:05] I have no clue of this,

[01:12:06] but when you're going downhill is when you have the hill heels locked in

[01:12:10] uphill travel.

[01:12:13] Generally the heel is unlocked.

[01:12:15] Yeah.

[01:12:15] And part of,

[01:12:16] you know,

[01:12:16] when you have your heel locked in,

[01:12:18] you just have more control over your ski.

[01:12:21] So when you're skiing down,

[01:12:23] whether it's steep or you're trying to avoid,

[01:12:27] you know,

[01:12:27] any of them,

[01:12:28] you know,

[01:12:29] 1 million hazards that are out there,

[01:12:31] having your heel locked in just means that you can put it on edge quicker,

[01:12:35] you know,

[01:12:36] just like a hockey skate.

[01:12:37] You can just come to like a complete stop much more quickly.

[01:12:40] You can power your ski.

[01:12:42] You just have much more control when it's locked in.

[01:12:45] Generally,

[01:12:45] generally,

[01:12:45] if it's,

[01:12:46] if your ski is flopping around,

[01:12:47] you're going to,

[01:12:48] you're going to have a more difficult time on steeper terrain.

[01:12:51] And that's why you're not free healing like a telemark skier.

[01:12:55] That's why we're not free healing.

[01:12:57] There are some telemark skiers that are amazing and super comfortable in that

[01:13:02] terrain.

[01:13:02] And the very first person,

[01:13:06] the only other person that has skied all of the Adirondack 46s is Ron Conowitz.

[01:13:13] He did it on telemark skis.

[01:13:15] He's an amazing telemark skier.

[01:13:18] So this is not to say that you can't do it on telemark skis.

[01:13:21] It's just not the way that we ski.

[01:13:25] And,

[01:13:26] but totally possible to do it on telemark skis.

[01:13:29] And Ron is proof of that.

[01:13:31] No,

[01:13:32] all right.

[01:13:32] What we're talking about.

[01:13:33] Well,

[01:13:34] let's,

[01:13:34] let's have Stosh talk about something.

[01:13:36] He's got some clues on.

[01:13:38] Yes.

[01:13:38] Yes.

[01:13:38] So your hiking experience and the Catskills Adirondack,

[01:13:42] stuff like that.

[01:13:42] You want to chat.

[01:13:43] Did you get into,

[01:13:44] you got into skiing first.

[01:13:46] What got you into the hiking and the Catskills and stuff?

[01:13:48] Did you hike and then ski or did you ski and then,

[01:13:51] then hike or both?

[01:13:53] You know,

[01:13:53] I was more of a skier,

[01:13:54] but you know,

[01:13:55] I was in the Boy Scouts growing up.

[01:13:57] So did lots of outdoors things,

[01:14:00] you know,

[01:14:00] did some summer camps up on the Adirondacks though.

[01:14:03] I don't recall doing any of the high peaks when I was younger,

[01:14:07] but I always had an appreciation for the outdoors.

[01:14:10] But I think my formal hiking really started when I moved up to Woodstock in the

[01:14:17] mid two thousands and just wanted to start getting out into the mountains,

[01:14:20] you know,

[01:14:21] year round.

[01:14:22] So late two thousands started hiking the 35s,

[01:14:26] you know,

[01:14:27] did my first round of the Catskill 35s.

[01:14:31] And,

[01:14:31] you know,

[01:14:32] I don't remember the exact moment when I sort of started percolating the idea

[01:14:38] about skiing the 35s.

[01:14:40] But I know when I sort of formalized it,

[01:14:43] Doug and I were camping up here together and I sort of broached or,

[01:14:47] you know,

[01:14:48] floated the idea to him that I wanted to try and start skiing them after having

[01:14:54] hiked them all.

[01:14:56] And he said,

[01:14:57] I want to do it with you if you're going to do it.

[01:14:59] So that's when we kind of formally decided that we are going to try,

[01:15:03] try and ski them.

[01:15:04] And so that's when I started,

[01:15:06] you know,

[01:15:07] doing my second round of the 35s,

[01:15:10] but on skis this time.

[01:15:12] So,

[01:15:13] I mean,

[01:15:13] I know you said you don't remember when you wanted to ski,

[01:15:16] but like what,

[01:15:16] what made you that inspiration?

[01:15:18] What gave you that inspiration to be like,

[01:15:20] man,

[01:15:20] I want to ski down this.

[01:15:21] It just,

[01:15:22] was it just like some sort of this,

[01:15:23] like the powder was good and you're just like,

[01:15:25] man,

[01:15:25] this would be a crazy experience.

[01:15:27] I,

[01:15:27] you know,

[01:15:28] I think it,

[01:15:28] you know,

[01:15:29] it was sort of an extension of what I was mentioning before of just not being

[01:15:32] super excited about skiing at the resorts,

[01:15:37] you know,

[01:15:37] and at the time,

[01:15:39] at the time I was,

[01:15:41] I had a,

[01:15:42] I was still,

[01:15:43] you know,

[01:15:44] Monday through Friday,

[01:15:45] I was living in New York city.

[01:15:47] I owned a graphic design studio then.

[01:15:49] So I was,

[01:15:50] you know,

[01:15:51] running a company and managing employees and clients and all of that.

[01:15:55] So I,

[01:15:56] my time to ski was on the weekends and coming up here,

[01:16:00] that's everyone else's time to ski in the weekend.

[01:16:02] And it just,

[01:16:03] it was depressing.

[01:16:05] And I just,

[01:16:07] you know,

[01:16:08] just,

[01:16:09] you know,

[01:16:09] we get out into the woods and the mountains to sometimes get away from

[01:16:12] people or to do things with just the small groups of people that we love.

[01:16:17] And so I think it was somewhat born out of just not wanting to be around all

[01:16:22] of the people at the resorts and not wanting to pay a hundred dollars to be

[01:16:26] with thousands of people.

[01:16:27] And,

[01:16:28] um,

[01:16:30] yeah,

[01:16:30] it just seemed more interesting to go out and see if the Catskills were skiable.

[01:16:37] I,

[01:16:38] you know,

[01:16:38] I,

[01:16:38] I knew from hiking that some of the,

[01:16:40] some of the mountains would be fine,

[01:16:42] you know,

[01:16:43] like skiing down from a hundred fire,

[01:16:44] you know,

[01:16:44] any of those Jeep roads,

[01:16:45] it's just not really a problem,

[01:16:47] but it just seemed interesting to find out if other things were skiable.

[01:16:52] And also just to start poking around,

[01:16:54] it makes you,

[01:16:55] when you're out hiking or spending time in the mountains and you're thinking

[01:17:02] about it through a skier's lens,

[01:17:03] you start looking around,

[01:17:06] you start scanning things differently and you start looking for,

[01:17:10] Oh,

[01:17:11] this is,

[01:17:11] you know,

[01:17:12] this is really open.

[01:17:14] And I,

[01:17:14] I'm saying open in air quotes,

[01:17:15] but like,

[01:17:16] you know,

[01:17:17] where is there not a lot of undergrowth or where is there some sort of,

[01:17:22] you know,

[01:17:23] there's not a lot of blow down or where is the,

[01:17:25] where are these old sort of Jeep roads that nobody talks about where there's

[01:17:29] maybe a path that's 15 feet wide that goes from,

[01:17:33] you know,

[01:17:34] a summit or some ridgeline down to the bottom.

[01:17:37] So you,

[01:17:37] you really start imagining the mountains in a different way.

[01:17:41] And it just,

[01:17:41] it kind of makes it exciting.

[01:17:43] It like starts to become a little bit of like a treasure hunt of like what,

[01:17:47] what's out there.

[01:17:48] And it just reframes the way that you start thinking about the mountains out

[01:17:52] here.

[01:17:53] And so I think there was just a little bit of that excitement about like,

[01:17:57] what if,

[01:17:58] and,

[01:17:58] and,

[01:17:59] you know,

[01:17:59] what's possible.

[01:18:00] So Jamie,

[01:18:01] Jamie has just validated.

[01:18:03] What I suspected is every skier like myself,

[01:18:08] when they walk through the Catskills,

[01:18:11] whether it's in the summer,

[01:18:12] when there's no snow or in the winter,

[01:18:14] when there's a ton of snow,

[01:18:16] you ask yourself,

[01:18:18] is this skiable?

[01:18:19] I'd like to ski this.

[01:18:21] Now,

[01:18:23] 99.999% of the skiers who hike the Catskills say,

[01:18:29] no,

[01:18:30] I could not ski down Indian Head from the summit with the pair of skis on.

[01:18:37] Yeah.

[01:18:37] It's,

[01:18:38] it's not possible.

[01:18:39] But yeah,

[01:18:40] it's funny that you say that because I did,

[01:18:44] I had a friend that wanted to do the devil's path this fall.

[01:18:48] And so I agreed to do it with him.

[01:18:51] And,

[01:18:52] you know,

[01:18:52] I hadn't been up to Indian Head,

[01:18:53] I think since I skied it 10 years ago.

[01:18:57] And I just couldn't believe,

[01:18:59] you know,

[01:18:59] things look different when there's a lot of snow.

[01:19:02] I couldn't believe what I had skied down some of those,

[01:19:06] those spots there.

[01:19:07] Cause I'm just not up there in the summer.

[01:19:09] I do a lot of my hiking in the winter or my,

[01:19:11] you know,

[01:19:12] obviously my skiing in the winter.

[01:19:15] And I mean,

[01:19:16] I'll be honest,

[01:19:16] even I was scratching my head.

[01:19:18] I can't believe I went down this section right here.

[01:19:21] Um,

[01:19:22] it's insane.

[01:19:23] Yeah.

[01:19:23] Yeah.

[01:19:23] It's totally insane.

[01:19:25] Yeah.

[01:19:25] I can't what you,

[01:19:26] your brother and,

[01:19:28] um,

[01:19:28] Julie McGuire have done.

[01:19:30] I just,

[01:19:31] I can't,

[01:19:31] I can't fathom it because it's just,

[01:19:33] there's all those hazards out there.

[01:19:35] And that the three of you survived dead is like,

[01:19:38] to me is like,

[01:19:38] wow,

[01:19:39] that's crazy.

[01:19:39] Yeah.

[01:19:40] So it's unbelievable.

[01:19:42] Yeah.

[01:19:42] So,

[01:19:43] I mean,

[01:19:43] we're going to keep it in the Catskills,

[01:19:45] uh,

[01:19:46] a little bit.

[01:19:46] So when,

[01:19:47] what was your first hiking or like skiing experience on the 3500?

[01:19:51] What was your first ski down?

[01:19:52] Ski up,

[01:19:53] ski down.

[01:19:54] Yeah.

[01:19:54] The first one was,

[01:19:54] was Hockett,

[01:19:55] uh,

[01:19:57] December,

[01:19:58] December 29th,

[01:19:59] 2012.

[01:20:00] I think,

[01:20:01] you know,

[01:20:02] that area up there just on route 42 gets a lot of snow.

[01:20:06] Um,

[01:20:07] and you know,

[01:20:08] it wasn't,

[01:20:08] it's not,

[01:20:09] as you guys know,

[01:20:10] it's not a super long,

[01:20:11] it's just,

[01:20:12] you know,

[01:20:12] you get out of the car and you're,

[01:20:14] you're on some skiable terrain there.

[01:20:16] So,

[01:20:16] and the woods,

[01:20:17] the woods are fairly open.

[01:20:19] So it just,

[01:20:19] it just seemed like a,

[01:20:20] that's an easy,

[01:20:21] an easy first move to,

[01:20:23] to make.

[01:20:24] And did you ski down through the hemlock grove?

[01:20:27] Yeah.

[01:20:27] Where,

[01:20:28] where is I'm curious?

[01:20:29] I mean,

[01:20:29] it's a very open,

[01:20:31] you know,

[01:20:31] an open mountain,

[01:20:33] which is good.

[01:20:33] I think,

[01:20:34] you know,

[01:20:35] my recollection is I almost went up straight kind of from the,

[01:20:40] um,

[01:20:40] parking lot,

[01:20:41] like,

[01:20:42] like instead of kind of cutting over to your left and going up,

[01:20:46] which I think is maybe the more like over towards like the waterfall and

[01:20:49] stream.

[01:20:50] I think in my mind,

[01:20:52] I just went straight up because it felt a little bit more bowl like in there.

[01:20:57] And then I might've followed the ridgeline over to the true summit.

[01:21:01] Yeah.

[01:21:02] I,

[01:21:02] I have a terrible memory,

[01:21:03] but that's like,

[01:21:03] that's sort of my recollection of,

[01:21:05] of what I did.

[01:21:06] Um,

[01:21:07] so.

[01:21:08] Interesting.

[01:21:08] That's interesting for a first ski down.

[01:21:10] You wouldn't do something like balsam,

[01:21:12] like,

[01:21:12] or some easy.

[01:21:13] No,

[01:21:14] I think,

[01:21:15] yeah,

[01:21:16] I don't know.

[01:21:16] Maybe it was just the snow condition.

[01:21:18] There was a bit more snow out there.

[01:21:19] I'm not,

[01:21:20] I don't really recall exactly what I was thinking,

[01:21:22] but,

[01:21:22] um,

[01:21:23] that's what I did first.

[01:21:24] You have any like,

[01:21:26] uh,

[01:21:27] favorites up in the cats that you've skied,

[01:21:29] uh,

[01:21:29] that you would constantly overdo that would just love.

[01:21:33] Um,

[01:21:34] the sleeper surprise for me was North dome from Sprucedon road.

[01:21:41] Ooh,

[01:21:41] the day that we did it,

[01:21:44] we actually dug and I,

[01:21:46] so I'll preface this by saying the week that we finished,

[01:21:51] which was March of two 2014,

[01:21:53] there was a huge snow storm up here.

[01:21:56] I don't know.

[01:21:57] It probably dumped two feet of snow.

[01:21:59] And I took a week off of work.

[01:22:02] My brother drove down from Rochester and we skied 14 peaks in seven days.

[01:22:11] And that day that we skied North dome,

[01:22:13] we actually skied Wittenberg and Cornell first.

[01:22:16] And I think daylight savings was that day.

[01:22:19] And then we drove over to North dome,

[01:22:23] you know,

[01:22:24] mid afternoon and started skiing out and got to the summit.

[01:22:28] The sun was setting.

[01:22:29] It was beautiful,

[01:22:29] but there was so much snow that coming back down those cliff bands,

[01:22:33] it was all skiable and it was deep.

[01:22:36] And those cliff bands were super fun.

[01:22:39] And,

[01:22:40] you know,

[01:22:40] I don't know if there's been enough snow up there since,

[01:22:43] you know,

[01:22:43] we did it in 2014,

[01:22:44] but if that ever got a ton of snow again,

[01:22:47] I would happily go back there and,

[01:22:49] and ski that again.

[01:22:50] And steep area.

[01:22:52] Yeah,

[01:22:53] it was fun.

[01:22:53] You know,

[01:22:54] it was just one of those things I was,

[01:22:55] I was sort of,

[01:22:56] we went in and I was sort of dreading it,

[01:22:58] you know,

[01:22:58] having just hiked it once in the summertime for my first round.

[01:23:01] And we got out there and found a kind of an easy ish way up through the

[01:23:06] cliff bands.

[01:23:07] And then we came back down.

[01:23:08] It was super fun.

[01:23:09] And yeah,

[01:23:11] it was one of those things that you go in sort of dreading and then it

[01:23:13] turns out to be the complete opposite.

[01:23:15] So when you skied the,

[01:23:17] the mountains and the Catskills that have a marked trail leading to the

[01:23:22] summit,

[01:23:23] is that the route you would take up and down or on some of those,

[01:23:27] would you take another route down because it was more skiable than the

[01:23:32] marked trail?

[01:23:34] Or funner.

[01:23:36] Yeah.

[01:23:38] On the way up,

[01:23:39] especially if it's something that's just broken out and we don't have to

[01:23:43] break trail,

[01:23:43] we would stick to the trail,

[01:23:47] but we're always kind of in the same way that you're just looking around for

[01:23:50] skiable terrain.

[01:23:52] We're always scanning,

[01:23:53] you know,

[01:23:53] especially if we have to go up through some cliff band,

[01:23:56] we might be looking to our left and right 50 or a hundred feet and thinking,

[01:24:00] okay,

[01:24:00] when we come back down,

[01:24:01] we're going to skirt out and kind of do,

[01:24:04] you know,

[01:24:05] we're going to ski over there and then we're going to hook back to the

[01:24:07] trail.

[01:24:09] So we might kind of bob and weave on and off the trail on the way down.

[01:24:13] But we're sort of sticking to the ski trails.

[01:24:19] You know,

[01:24:20] up on the Adirondacks,

[01:24:21] there are a lot of larger natural landslides.

[01:24:25] And so there are some opportunities there to go off of the mark trail and to

[01:24:30] be on some really amazing,

[01:24:33] wide open skiable terrain,

[01:24:35] you know,

[01:24:36] not really the case down here in the Catskills.

[01:24:40] So kind of for the most part,

[01:24:42] it makes sense to sort of stick to the trail and then just pop on and off as,

[01:24:46] as you need to.

[01:24:48] Interesting.

[01:24:49] So there's,

[01:24:49] is there any places that you kind of like were surprised of where you went down

[01:24:53] and you're just like,

[01:24:54] God damn,

[01:24:54] besides North Dome,

[01:24:55] this is like,

[01:24:56] this is fun.

[01:24:57] Like,

[01:24:58] it's just one of those unexpected,

[01:24:59] like unexpected experiences of coming down.

[01:25:02] I mean,

[01:25:03] yeah,

[01:25:04] coming,

[01:25:04] you know,

[01:25:05] I remember coming down from Wittenberg,

[01:25:06] um,

[01:25:07] was fun.

[01:25:08] It was that,

[01:25:08] you know,

[01:25:09] anywhere where there's just,

[01:25:10] you know,

[01:25:10] sometimes you,

[01:25:11] when you have so many trees around,

[01:25:13] like you,

[01:25:14] you don't want it to be too fast,

[01:25:16] you know,

[01:25:16] not like,

[01:25:17] it's not like Doug and I can't ski fast,

[01:25:19] but when you have so many rocks and trees and hazards,

[01:25:22] like there's sometimes there's just a particular grade of steepness that just

[01:25:28] you're moving and you're moving at a fast dish pace.

[01:25:31] Um,

[01:25:32] and maybe there's some ups and downs and little bumps and bobs and weaves.

[01:25:35] And I feel like coming down a big chunk of Wittenberg,

[01:25:39] um,

[01:25:39] was sort of that fun,

[01:25:41] just like the perfect speed where we're like moving fast,

[01:25:45] definitely moving faster than you would be if you were hiking down.

[01:25:49] Um,

[01:25:49] but not so fast that you feel like you're out of control.

[01:25:54] And so that's,

[01:25:54] you know,

[01:25:55] that's like usually a pretty good,

[01:25:57] you know,

[01:25:57] a good feeling.

[01:25:58] Like we'll take that.

[01:25:59] Um,

[01:26:00] you know,

[01:26:00] this,

[01:26:00] we don't have to be moving at like 60 miles an hour.

[01:26:03] Um,

[01:26:04] like all those people over in like Colorado and stuff like that,

[01:26:07] where they're flying down the mountains,

[01:26:08] they call those people dead.

[01:26:10] When you're out West and you're above tree line and you have this beautiful powder,

[01:26:14] you can motor whatever,

[01:26:16] you know,

[01:26:16] as fast as you want to go.

[01:26:18] But it's just,

[01:26:19] you know,

[01:26:19] that's not prudent when you're here in the Catskills.

[01:26:22] So trees here too.

[01:26:23] We have trees,

[01:26:24] but,

[01:26:25] um,

[01:26:25] yeah.

[01:26:25] So speaking with about trees,

[01:26:27] you're wearing a helmet,

[01:26:30] wearing a helmet.

[01:26:31] Yep.

[01:26:31] Of course.

[01:26:32] Um,

[01:26:34] not going into the incident up in the Adirondacks,

[01:26:36] but in the,

[01:26:36] the Catskills,

[01:26:38] any injuries,

[01:26:38] any tree strikes,

[01:26:40] any dislocated shoulders,

[01:26:42] you know,

[01:26:43] did it get real ugly in the backwoods and the Catskills?

[01:26:46] Yeah.

[01:26:47] No,

[01:26:47] no serious tree strikes.

[01:26:50] Um,

[01:26:51] you know,

[01:26:51] Doug and I,

[01:26:52] we both grew up ski racing.

[01:26:53] As I talked about,

[01:26:54] we were both,

[01:26:55] we sort of are events that we excelled in.

[01:26:58] We are both pretty good slalom racers and,

[01:27:01] and Stosh for,

[01:27:02] you know,

[01:27:02] for,

[01:27:03] uh,

[01:27:04] for those that don't know,

[01:27:04] in slalom alpine racing,

[01:27:06] you are hitting every gate,

[01:27:09] these hard plastic gates.

[01:27:11] And so when you're slalom skiing,

[01:27:13] you're almost,

[01:27:13] you're wearing,

[01:27:14] essentially you're wearing body armor.

[01:27:16] You're wearing like,

[01:27:17] you know,

[01:27:18] a head guard,

[01:27:18] you're wearing pads on your knees,

[01:27:21] your,

[01:27:21] your poles,

[01:27:22] your arms,

[01:27:23] you're just hitting stuff all the time.

[01:27:26] And so Doug and I are used to hitting things and we sort of go into it with a little bit of that

[01:27:31] sort of ski racer attitude,

[01:27:34] you know,

[01:27:34] for the smaller things,

[01:27:35] for all those like whippersnappers and smaller,

[01:27:37] you know,

[01:27:38] brush things.

[01:27:39] Yeah.

[01:27:39] We,

[01:27:40] we hit plenty of things.

[01:27:41] Um,

[01:27:42] we try not to hit the big stuff,

[01:27:43] but we do,

[01:27:45] we do wear,

[01:27:46] wear helmets and that's super important,

[01:27:48] you know,

[01:27:49] not just for the trees.

[01:27:50] I mean,

[01:27:50] just for everything that's buried,

[01:27:52] you know,

[01:27:52] you catch something and you go flying and,

[01:27:54] you know,

[01:27:55] you never know what you're going to land on.

[01:27:57] Any,

[01:27:58] any extreme stuff in the Catskills that you,

[01:28:00] you encountered that you're just like,

[01:28:03] like,

[01:28:03] Oh,

[01:28:03] here we go.

[01:28:04] I mean,

[01:28:04] the Adirondacks are a whole different story.

[01:28:06] We'll get into that.

[01:28:07] But like,

[01:28:08] you know,

[01:28:08] plateau is not,

[01:28:10] was not easy.

[01:28:11] Uh,

[01:28:12] that,

[01:28:12] you know,

[01:28:13] just steep going up,

[01:28:14] um,

[01:28:15] kind of steep and icy.

[01:28:17] Yeah.

[01:28:18] There's just,

[01:28:18] is there a lot of like with,

[01:28:20] with that stuff?

[01:28:21] Is there,

[01:28:21] you know,

[01:28:21] being,

[01:28:22] not being a non-skier is a lot,

[01:28:23] a lot of like crisscross stuff of where you have to jump to the next one and stuff like that.

[01:28:27] A lot of crisscross.

[01:28:29] Yeah.

[01:28:29] A lot of crisscross.

[01:28:30] When we,

[01:28:31] when we grew up ski racing,

[01:28:33] there was a drill that our coaches made us do over and over again.

[01:28:37] And it's called an elephant hop.

[01:28:39] And on a ski,

[01:28:41] imagine you're on a,

[01:28:43] it doesn't have to be steep,

[01:28:44] but it can be.

[01:28:45] Your skis are going across the hill.

[01:28:49] So they're not facing downhill.

[01:28:50] They're sort of,

[01:28:51] um,

[01:28:52] perpendicular.

[01:28:52] And the idea is to jump up and to spin your skis 180 degrees.

[01:28:58] So if you're standing on your left leg,

[01:29:01] looking downhill,

[01:29:02] you jump up and you turn your ski so that your skis basically do a 180 underneath you and you land again.

[01:29:08] Also called a jump turn.

[01:29:10] And we would practice those.

[01:29:13] Our coaches would make us do those for hours,

[01:29:16] every ski practice.

[01:29:17] And that is,

[01:29:19] that skill comes in so handy when you're going down something steep.

[01:29:24] Because let's say plateau,

[01:29:26] you've got these switchbacks and you're facing one direction and you need to kind of navigate around this steep drop off,

[01:29:34] or you need your skis to be facing on the opposite,

[01:29:36] you know,

[01:29:37] 180 degrees opposite direction.

[01:29:39] And so you need to be able to jump up and just basically pivot your body around and almost land back down in the same spot.

[01:29:46] If you need to,

[01:29:47] sometimes you're doing it and you're jumping down a little ledge or over something.

[01:29:52] Um,

[01:29:53] so yeah,

[01:29:53] there,

[01:29:54] there can be those,

[01:29:55] you're doing lots of jump turns,

[01:29:58] you know,

[01:29:58] we're not doing powdery stone plateau.

[01:30:01] You're really like,

[01:30:03] yeah,

[01:30:03] a lot of jumping and just navigating over hazards.

[01:30:07] Yeah.

[01:30:07] I could,

[01:30:08] I could only imagine some certain spots of like Wittenberg and stuff like that.

[01:30:12] You know,

[01:30:12] like you said,

[01:30:12] plateau and coming down certain parts of devil's path that you just,

[01:30:16] like I said,

[01:30:16] I'm the,

[01:30:17] I call it crisscross where you're just like hopping back and forth that I could see you guys.

[01:30:21] So you know,

[01:30:21] you and your Tad doing that.

[01:30:23] Maybe Tad might get back into this now,

[01:30:25] get him back into doing the high peaks.

[01:30:28] It's never too late,

[01:30:29] Tad.

[01:30:30] I doubt it.

[01:30:31] But so,

[01:30:32] but somewhat on that theme,

[01:30:34] what relative to your technique of skiing down these mountains and the Catskills changed?

[01:30:42] Over the years that you did it.

[01:30:44] Anything?

[01:30:46] It's a good question.

[01:30:47] I don't know about our tech.

[01:30:50] I'm not so,

[01:30:52] our technique probably didn't change that much.

[01:30:55] I think more so what changed is the things that we were bringing with us,

[01:31:02] the kind of planning that we were doing,

[01:31:05] and also just the way that Doug and I communicated with one another.

[01:31:11] All of those things evolved over the last 12 years,

[01:31:16] as it does for anyone that is hiking or doing things out in the mountains.

[01:31:20] You learn things,

[01:31:21] you adapt,

[01:31:22] you add a piece of equipment.

[01:31:25] You decide that you're going to bring two or three of certain things because things break.

[01:31:30] You get cold.

[01:31:33] You're out there for longer hours and days.

[01:31:38] You know,

[01:31:38] when Doug and I were doing the Adirondacks,

[01:31:40] some of those mountains included camping one or two nights,

[01:31:46] you know,

[01:31:46] winter camping.

[01:31:47] So,

[01:31:48] yeah,

[01:31:49] you start thinking about things differently.

[01:31:51] So,

[01:31:52] yeah,

[01:31:52] like the technique part didn't change.

[01:31:55] You know,

[01:31:56] we might have like evolved our gear a little bit,

[01:31:59] but,

[01:32:00] but I think like the way that we were skiing them probably stayed the same,

[01:32:05] but,

[01:32:06] but certainly like the things that we were bringing with us changed.

[01:32:09] So,

[01:32:09] so why don't you tell us about that?

[01:32:11] What would be your five pro tips to somebody who's starting out to tackle the high peaks of the Catskills?

[01:32:23] Yeah,

[01:32:23] I think some,

[01:32:24] some pro tips,

[01:32:26] you know,

[01:32:26] Doug and I,

[01:32:27] even though we did a,

[01:32:29] you know,

[01:32:30] a few of the Catskills,

[01:32:31] we did solo,

[01:32:33] uh,

[01:32:33] and a few of the Adirondacks,

[01:32:34] we did solo.

[01:32:35] So,

[01:32:36] I think what we would both agree on is that skiing,

[01:32:41] I mean,

[01:32:42] being out there in the winter can be dangerous no matter if you're hiking or skiing,

[01:32:45] but skiing brings just another level of potential injury.

[01:32:50] Um,

[01:32:51] and,

[01:32:51] you know,

[01:32:52] potential serious injury,

[01:32:54] hitting a tree,

[01:32:55] breaking something,

[01:32:56] spraining something,

[01:32:56] you have more equipment that can go wrong.

[01:32:59] So,

[01:32:59] I think doing it with a partner,

[01:33:01] and it doesn't have to be someone that's also doing it on skis,

[01:33:04] it can just be someone that's,

[01:33:06] you know,

[01:33:06] hiking on snowshoes.

[01:33:07] I really think that's super important.

[01:33:10] Um,

[01:33:11] and so that might be number one.

[01:33:13] Uh,

[01:33:14] number two,

[01:33:15] you know,

[01:33:16] these days,

[01:33:16] most people carry a Garmin or some sort of,

[01:33:19] you know,

[01:33:20] emergency beacon.

[01:33:21] When we were doing the Catskills,

[01:33:23] we did not have one,

[01:33:24] and I didn't start carrying one until partway through the Adirondacks.

[01:33:28] Um,

[01:33:29] certainly,

[01:33:29] you know,

[01:33:30] having an emergency device is super important.

[01:33:33] Um,

[01:33:33] helmet you touched on,

[01:33:35] very important if you're skiing,

[01:33:37] um,

[01:33:38] to have a helmet.

[01:33:39] Um,

[01:33:41] backcountry,

[01:33:43] ski equipment,

[01:33:44] you know,

[01:33:45] we started to carry extra skins with us.

[01:33:50] Um,

[01:33:50] sometimes the clips on your skins snap off.

[01:33:54] Sometimes the glue doesn't stick to your skins anymore after you've been using them all day.

[01:33:59] Or you try to cross a stream and you dip your ski into the stream and the skin gets wet and ices up and then it doesn't stick to your ski.

[01:34:07] And those skins are your ticket out.

[01:34:11] Um,

[01:34:11] so,

[01:34:12] if you have what we call a skin failure and you don't have a backup pair of skins,

[01:34:16] you're losing part of your traction.

[01:34:19] Um,

[01:34:20] and it can make your day that much more difficult.

[01:34:23] Um,

[01:34:23] um,

[01:34:25] carrying skins.

[01:34:26] Um,

[01:34:27] and then one thing that Doug and I started carrying this past year in the Adirondacks,

[01:34:31] um,

[01:34:32] especially because,

[01:34:33] you know,

[01:34:33] some of those mountains are,

[01:34:35] you know,

[01:34:35] quite a few of them are,

[01:34:36] you know,

[01:34:38] close to 20 mile round trip.

[01:34:40] And so you're 10 miles out.

[01:34:42] And if something happens,

[01:34:43] you've got 10 miles to get back.

[01:34:45] Um,

[01:34:46] but we started carrying a small version of a snowshoe that,

[01:34:50] um,

[01:34:51] attaches to the bottom of a ski boot.

[01:34:54] And it,

[01:34:55] you use it in combination with the crampons that attach to the bottom of your ski boot.

[01:35:01] So we carry sort of climbing crampons,

[01:35:04] um,

[01:35:05] that we use on the bottom of our ski boot.

[01:35:07] And then these flat plastic snowshoes combined with the crampons.

[01:35:11] And part of why we started carrying these is because if you have a ski,

[01:35:16] you know,

[01:35:16] you break a binding or something happens with your ski,

[01:35:19] those skis are essentially your traction or flotation,

[01:35:24] um,

[01:35:26] device out there.

[01:35:26] It's basically your snowshoe.

[01:35:28] And if you don't have that ski,

[01:35:30] you're going to be punching through the snow for eight or 10 miles in a ski boot.

[01:35:36] And that is exhausting.

[01:35:38] Um,

[01:35:38] one of the,

[01:35:40] uh,

[01:35:41] one of the people in the film and variable,

[01:35:44] I interviewed Andrew Weibrecht,

[01:35:46] who is a Lake Placid native,

[01:35:49] uh,

[01:35:50] went on to be on the U S ski team.

[01:35:52] He won,

[01:35:53] uh,

[01:35:53] Olympic medals in two separate,

[01:35:55] uh,

[01:35:56] Olympics,

[01:35:57] um,

[01:35:58] as a ski racer.

[01:36:00] He was skiing.

[01:36:01] He was attempting to ski the 46 is around the same time as Doug and I,

[01:36:07] um,

[01:36:08] he has not finished.

[01:36:08] He got about halfway through.

[01:36:09] He broke a ski binding at the top of Mount Marshall and did not have the use of a ski

[01:36:19] for about eight miles to get back to the trailhead.

[01:36:24] And he described it as an Olympic,

[01:36:28] and he described it as an extremely difficult day.

[01:36:29] And this is an Olympic,

[01:36:30] an Olympian with two medals under his belt,

[01:36:34] extremely talented skier,

[01:36:35] super strong.

[01:36:36] And just to hear him talk in his own words about how difficult it was to get back,

[01:36:42] uh,

[01:36:43] with one working ski and one non-working ski.

[01:36:47] It's just,

[01:36:48] you,

[01:36:48] you don't want to have that happen.

[01:36:50] So,

[01:36:50] um,

[01:36:51] just to think about what,

[01:36:52] you know,

[01:36:53] what you have,

[01:36:54] what tools you have on hand to get yourself out of there.

[01:36:56] If something goes wrong,

[01:36:58] uh,

[01:36:58] with your ski is,

[01:36:59] is important.

[01:37:00] So I'll leave it at that.

[01:37:03] So what about like,

[01:37:04] let's get into a little bit out of the Catskills into the Adirondacks.

[01:37:07] Now I'm guessing that the Adirondacks are a little bit more extreme than the Catskills.

[01:37:11] By far.

[01:37:12] Yeah.

[01:37:13] I mean,

[01:37:13] you know,

[01:37:13] there's,

[01:37:14] well,

[01:37:14] there's,

[01:37:14] you know,

[01:37:15] if we're talking about the,

[01:37:16] the quote unquote high peaks up there,

[01:37:18] there's 46 of them.

[01:37:19] So I guess there's more,

[01:37:21] they are the peaks that are 4,000 feet or taller.

[01:37:25] So a few of them go above 5,000 couple,

[01:37:29] you know,

[01:37:29] a handful of them are above tree line,

[01:37:31] which makes them more exposed to weather and wind.

[01:37:37] Um,

[01:37:37] and also getting lost,

[01:37:40] um,

[01:37:40] when you're above tree line,

[01:37:42] you,

[01:37:42] um,

[01:37:43] you don't have the,

[01:37:44] the benefit of a formal trail up there.

[01:37:47] And yes,

[01:37:48] there are rock pile cairns sometimes,

[01:37:50] but the weather moves in up there in the winter and you can be in a whiteout.

[01:37:56] And you could just walk off the wrong or ski off the wrong side of a mountain and just be going in a completely wrong direction.

[01:38:04] Um,

[01:38:05] and the distances are,

[01:38:07] yeah,

[01:38:07] yeah.

[01:38:08] You know,

[01:38:08] there's just,

[01:38:09] we,

[01:38:09] you know,

[01:38:09] we,

[01:38:09] in the ski world,

[01:38:10] we call them approaches.

[01:38:11] Um,

[01:38:12] there,

[01:38:12] you just have more miles of getting in before you even start climbing up,

[01:38:18] whatever peak it is you're doing.

[01:38:19] And,

[01:38:20] you know,

[01:38:21] a lot of those round trips are 10,

[01:38:24] 12,

[01:38:24] 15,

[01:38:25] 20,

[01:38:26] 21,

[01:38:26] 22 miles.

[01:38:28] Um,

[01:38:28] so there are longer days up there.

[01:38:31] So yeah,

[01:38:32] it's just,

[01:38:32] everything just is brought up like another level up there for sure.

[01:38:37] Any,

[01:38:37] any crazy,

[01:38:38] uh,

[01:38:39] experiences out there?

[01:38:40] Of course,

[01:38:40] uh,

[01:38:41] it'll be,

[01:38:41] most of it will be in the film,

[01:38:42] uh,

[01:38:43] hopefully,

[01:38:44] but like,

[01:38:44] what,

[01:38:45] what can you say?

[01:38:46] Like,

[01:38:46] yeah,

[01:38:46] well,

[01:38:47] I,

[01:38:47] I guess,

[01:38:48] um,

[01:38:49] one thing that is not in the film at all,

[01:38:51] uh,

[01:38:51] was a day that I was out skiing solo.

[01:38:54] Uh,

[01:38:55] I was,

[01:38:55] uh,

[01:38:56] I went up to ski at,

[01:38:58] uh,

[01:38:58] Algonquin,

[01:38:59] uh,

[01:39:00] which is the second highest mountain in New York,

[01:39:02] uh,

[01:39:02] and Iroquois.

[01:39:04] And,

[01:39:04] um,

[01:39:05] I had been on Algonquin before summited.

[01:39:08] And then in between Algonquin and Iroquois,

[01:39:11] um,

[01:39:12] there's a small little bump of a peak called boundary peak,

[01:39:14] and Algonquin is above tree line.

[01:39:18] And then you drop back down into sort of a minefield of trees.

[01:39:23] It's imagine a forest of pine trees where the pine trees are buried like 80%.

[01:39:29] So you see about five or six feet of the treetops that are exposed.

[01:39:34] Um,

[01:39:35] and that goes on for like a quarter or half a mile.

[01:39:39] And there was no clear path through there.

[01:39:42] I made it about halfway through on my skis and I fell into a tree.

[01:39:50] Well,

[01:39:51] if you don't,

[01:39:52] if you don't know what a tree well is,

[01:39:53] it's sort of a,

[01:39:54] uh,

[01:39:55] you know,

[01:39:56] it's,

[01:39:56] it's when the snow collapses,

[01:39:59] the snow that builds up around the edge of a tree,

[01:40:03] um,

[01:40:04] collapses.

[01:40:04] And what happened to these pine trees,

[01:40:07] you know,

[01:40:07] the boughs of the pine trees are sort of holding up some of the snow,

[01:40:10] but there's not a lot of snow underneath.

[01:40:12] And I fell in upside down into a tree.

[01:40:17] Well,

[01:40:17] with my skis attached above me.

[01:40:20] So I'm sort of hanging like a mobile and I landed head first.

[01:40:26] I'm upside down and I could breathe.

[01:40:30] And the problem,

[01:40:31] you know,

[01:40:31] these tree wells,

[01:40:32] especially if you're out West somewhere where the snow can be very deep is if

[01:40:36] you fall into a tree.

[01:40:37] Well,

[01:40:37] a lot of people end up suffocating because they are,

[01:40:42] uh,

[01:40:42] consumed,

[01:40:43] uh,

[01:40:43] you know,

[01:40:43] they're upside down and they,

[01:40:46] um,

[01:40:46] their airway fills with snow.

[01:40:47] So my airway was open,

[01:40:49] but my skis were attached above me.

[01:40:53] I had launched one of my poles out somewhere.

[01:40:56] The other ski pole fell across my chest and my body weight was on it.

[01:41:02] So it was almost like I was mummified with my hands crossed on top of my ski

[01:41:06] pole hanging by my skis above me.

[01:41:10] And that just set me into a little bit of a panic.

[01:41:14] And so it was about five minutes of some Houdini moves trying to free my ski pole

[01:41:20] because I needed my ski pole to then punch up at my ski binding and release my ski

[01:41:27] binding.

[01:41:27] So I could climb out of the,

[01:41:29] um,

[01:41:30] hole that I fell into.

[01:41:32] So that,

[01:41:32] that was an eyeopening,

[01:41:35] um,

[01:41:36] extremely scary moment.

[01:41:38] Um,

[01:41:39] and you know,

[01:41:40] one of those times where I just decided what the Doug and I were going to do,

[01:41:44] you know,

[01:41:45] we needed to do this.

[01:41:46] I needed to have a partner.

[01:41:47] Um,

[01:41:48] you know,

[01:41:48] it's not the stuff that you're skiing up there as far as like the steepness and

[01:41:52] whatever,

[01:41:53] that's,

[01:41:53] that's not the issue.

[01:41:54] It's just when you get into a situation like that,

[01:41:57] um,

[01:41:58] you,

[01:41:58] you know,

[01:41:59] you need someone around and I didn't have that person.

[01:42:02] And luckily I was able to free myself,

[01:42:05] but it could have been a different situation.

[01:42:07] So,

[01:42:07] um,

[01:42:08] yeah,

[01:42:08] super scary moment,

[01:42:09] but we got,

[01:42:11] you know,

[01:42:11] I got out of there.

[01:42:13] Now,

[01:42:13] whether,

[01:42:13] whether you're doing the Adirondack high peaks,

[01:42:15] is it more faster skiing,

[01:42:18] open skiing than,

[01:42:19] than the Catskills?

[01:42:20] Would you take,

[01:42:21] is it similar to the Catskills as you would take the trail up and the trail down?

[01:42:25] Or would,

[01:42:25] like you said,

[01:42:25] with the slides,

[01:42:26] they have the slides that you can cascade down.

[01:42:28] You know,

[01:42:29] our,

[01:42:29] Doug,

[01:42:29] our strategy was to,

[01:42:31] uh,

[01:42:31] to mostly stick to the trail.

[01:42:33] There,

[01:42:33] there were a couple instances where we,

[01:42:36] uh,

[01:42:37] either skied up a slide or ski down a slide,

[01:42:41] but we,

[01:42:44] even though there are opportunities where we could have ascended by the trail and then cut

[01:42:49] over and skied down a slide,

[01:42:52] I,

[01:42:53] especially up there in the Adirondacks where the slides are steeper and there's a lot more

[01:42:58] hazard of ice or exposed areas or avalanches,

[01:43:03] which are a real thing.

[01:43:05] And we do carry,

[01:43:06] um,

[01:43:07] avalanche gear when we're skiing the slides up there.

[01:43:10] I am always one to,

[01:43:13] if I'm going to ski a slide anywhere that has sort of dangerous terrain,

[01:43:18] I want to ascend.

[01:43:20] I want to ski up or hike,

[01:43:22] you know,

[01:43:23] hike up that slide so I can assess what we're going to be skiing down.

[01:43:27] Um,

[01:43:28] so we tried not to go up a ski trail and then cut over to a slide and ski down it,

[01:43:35] even though that would seem like the fun thing to do.

[01:43:37] Um,

[01:43:38] you know,

[01:43:38] and if maybe if we lived up there and we were out there and able to assess the situations

[01:43:42] on a day to day basis,

[01:43:43] we would feel better about doing something like that.

[01:43:46] But,

[01:43:47] you know,

[01:43:47] traveling into the area and,

[01:43:49] and kind of coming in cold,

[01:43:51] you know,

[01:43:51] unless we were going to go up the slide,

[01:43:53] um,

[01:43:54] we probably weren't going to come back down it if we came up a different way.

[01:43:58] So,

[01:43:58] so that's all to say,

[01:43:59] you know,

[01:43:59] that leaves lots of things for us to go up there and do some fun slide skiing now.

[01:44:04] Um,

[01:44:04] now that we're done with this,

[01:44:05] this longer project.

[01:44:07] Is it faster skiing than going to the Catskills?

[01:44:11] Yeah.

[01:44:12] you know,

[01:44:13] some yes and no,

[01:44:15] uh,

[01:44:15] yeah,

[01:44:15] it just depends.

[01:44:16] Um,

[01:44:17] you know,

[01:44:17] some of the,

[01:44:18] what's cool about some of the mountains,

[01:44:20] uh,

[01:44:21] and the Adirondacks is,

[01:44:23] you know,

[01:44:24] a long time ago,

[01:44:25] they actually cut formally cut some ski trails.

[01:44:29] Um,

[01:44:29] so there's actually coming off of right mountain coming off of Mount Marcy.

[01:44:34] There are a few old designated,

[01:44:37] designated ski trails that are not very wide.

[01:44:40] I mean,

[01:44:40] you could almost put your hands out left or right,

[01:44:42] and that's like the width of the trail,

[01:44:44] but they are trails that are,

[01:44:46] uh,

[01:44:47] designated for skier and hikers are not allowed on them.

[01:44:51] So if you're doing Mount Marcy,

[01:44:53] which is the tallest mountain in New York state and a really fun ski up and ski

[01:44:57] down,

[01:44:58] part of that ski down is you're able to get off of the formal hiking trail,

[01:45:03] cut over to the ski trail and ski down.

[01:45:07] Which makes it really fun because you don't have to worry about hikers being on

[01:45:11] there and you just know that you have it to yourself.

[01:45:14] So yeah,

[01:45:15] a couple of mountains can be faster than the Catskills,

[01:45:18] but plenty of it is just as slow as being down here in the Catskills.

[01:45:24] Tad,

[01:45:24] you got anything?

[01:45:25] Well,

[01:45:26] all right.

[01:45:27] I've got a few more questions here.

[01:45:29] So what I want to know just in general terms,

[01:45:34] what percentage of this experience,

[01:45:39] whether it will,

[01:45:39] we'll just stick to the Catskills.

[01:45:41] You're skiing the 3,500 in the Catskills.

[01:45:43] What percentage of the time out there was type two fun?

[01:45:47] Yeah.

[01:45:47] Right.

[01:45:48] Good question.

[01:45:49] I just want to know,

[01:45:50] is it,

[01:45:50] I mean,

[01:45:51] was there enough type one fun out there to quantify or we're,

[01:45:54] we're talking a lot of time in the type two category?

[01:45:59] I feel like it ends up being a lot in the type two category.

[01:46:04] You know,

[01:46:05] sometimes,

[01:46:05] and sometimes that's just a product of like the day that you get it,

[01:46:10] just the weather,

[01:46:11] you know,

[01:46:11] it's just,

[01:46:12] it's not like under perfect conditions that might not be type two,

[01:46:16] but,

[01:46:17] you know,

[01:46:18] especially with the way our winters go and,

[01:46:21] you know,

[01:46:22] Julie McGuire faced this.

[01:46:23] She wasn't able,

[01:46:24] she,

[01:46:24] she got out and skied one peak the entire winter.

[01:46:26] I didn't do any back country skiing in the Catskills last winter.

[01:46:30] So I think as back country skiers,

[01:46:34] when these storms roll in,

[01:46:36] you just like,

[01:46:37] you have snow fever and you go out and you chase this snow,

[01:46:41] snow.

[01:46:43] And sometimes that means maybe there was an epic snow storm the day before,

[01:46:47] but then the next day when you get out,

[01:46:49] it's sleeting or it's,

[01:46:51] you know,

[01:46:52] frozen over or the conditions have totally changed.

[01:46:56] And,

[01:46:57] you know,

[01:46:58] that kind of,

[01:46:59] you know,

[01:46:59] hints at the title of the movie that I made,

[01:47:02] but that's just,

[01:47:04] that's,

[01:47:04] that's life in the Northeast and that's back country skiing life and the

[01:47:10] Catskills of the Adirondacks.

[01:47:12] You just,

[01:47:12] you don't get perfect conditions all that often.

[01:47:16] So it means that you're just out there.

[01:47:19] And as any of us who have hiked in the winter,

[01:47:23] you know,

[01:47:23] that what you find at the trailhead is not what you find at the top.

[01:47:27] And there's just,

[01:47:28] there's a kaleidoscope of conditions from top to bottom.

[01:47:32] So I,

[01:47:33] you know,

[01:47:34] it's really like that.

[01:47:35] Those days where it's perfect from summit to trailhead are super rare.

[01:47:40] So there's usually somewhere,

[01:47:42] somewhere,

[01:47:43] you know,

[01:47:44] from the bottom to the top,

[01:47:46] there's some type two aspect that pops up for sure.

[01:47:50] Yeah.

[01:47:50] I mean,

[01:47:51] I,

[01:47:51] I was out two days this past weekend,

[01:47:53] in my opinion,

[01:47:55] no time in the types type two zone at all.

[01:47:59] I have done the lone to Rocky hike after a significant snowfall where just a

[01:48:07] little bit after the point of no return,

[01:48:10] you realize that the rest of the day is going to be deep.

[01:48:14] Yeah.

[01:48:15] In 2.X territory.

[01:48:17] So I've been there.

[01:48:19] Um,

[01:48:20] but I've also,

[01:48:20] I've done lone and Rocky multiple times.

[01:48:23] I've done the cat skill,

[01:48:24] uh,

[01:48:26] circuit multiple times.

[01:48:28] You know,

[01:48:29] I don't know exactly how many,

[01:48:31] but this leads me to my question.

[01:48:34] Are you going to do another round?

[01:48:37] Of the 35 hundreds and the cat skills on skis,

[01:48:40] or was one enough?

[01:48:44] I actually texted Julie today and I told her I'm,

[01:48:49] I'm,

[01:48:49] I'm done.

[01:48:50] She's,

[01:48:51] she's,

[01:48:52] you're done.

[01:48:53] That's it.

[01:48:54] Well,

[01:48:54] I,

[01:48:54] you know,

[01:48:55] not to say that I won't go out and ski things.

[01:48:57] Of course I'll go out and ski things,

[01:48:59] but,

[01:48:59] you know,

[01:49:00] I think there was part of me that was thinking I would,

[01:49:04] might continue on and try to ski the cat skill highest hundred.

[01:49:08] I texted her today and said,

[01:49:11] she can have it.

[01:49:12] I'm,

[01:49:12] I'm not touching it,

[01:49:14] you know,

[01:49:15] especially in just following her around these last,

[01:49:18] you know,

[01:49:19] these last four peaks of hers and just being out there,

[01:49:22] you know,

[01:49:23] for me and for my brother,

[01:49:25] it's been 12 years of just going out and slogging it out on all of these

[01:49:32] peaks.

[01:49:32] And it's,

[01:49:34] you know,

[01:49:35] I guess as satisfying as it is to come back from each one of these,

[01:49:39] like,

[01:49:40] we're just totally drained.

[01:49:42] I mean,

[01:49:42] we're exhausted,

[01:49:44] you know,

[01:49:44] you just need a,

[01:49:46] you know,

[01:49:46] at least I do,

[01:49:47] like,

[01:49:48] I need a full day of recovery.

[01:49:49] I,

[01:49:49] you know,

[01:49:50] I mean,

[01:49:50] when we were doing the cat skills,

[01:49:52] we,

[01:49:52] you know,

[01:49:52] especially when we were finishing,

[01:49:53] we were doing back to back to back days.

[01:49:55] We were just so pumped to get it done,

[01:49:57] but you know,

[01:49:58] the Adirondacks are bigger days and longer.

[01:50:01] And,

[01:50:02] you know,

[01:50:03] it's just,

[01:50:03] it's such a commitment of time.

[01:50:06] And,

[01:50:07] and I think for me right now,

[01:50:09] just where I'm at,

[01:50:10] like,

[01:50:11] you know,

[01:50:11] spending time with Julie and switching my interest over to filmmaking and

[01:50:16] following some people around in the mountains,

[01:50:19] like I,

[01:50:20] I'm okay with tagging along and,

[01:50:22] and putting in some epic days with them and watching them do it.

[01:50:27] But I'm probably not going to go out there and do another round on skis.

[01:50:32] But I'm excited for,

[01:50:33] you know,

[01:50:34] like I said,

[01:50:34] some other people are,

[01:50:36] you know,

[01:50:36] looks like some other people are starting it.

[01:50:38] And so I think it's fun to see how other people approach it and to see what

[01:50:44] else in the cat skills people decide to ski and,

[01:50:47] and,

[01:50:48] and,

[01:50:48] you know,

[01:50:49] maybe there's some epic secret ski run somewhere that nobody's come across

[01:50:55] that someone's going to discover.

[01:50:57] But yeah,

[01:50:57] well,

[01:50:58] on that note,

[01:50:59] I know there's quite a few slopes,

[01:51:03] and I'm not talking about cut ski slopes,

[01:51:05] but areas in the cat skills that are just great places to go and get a few

[01:51:11] hundred vertical feet of skiing.

[01:51:13] Yeah.

[01:51:14] Without going top to bottom on that particular mountain.

[01:51:17] And there's a couple back in the late eighties,

[01:51:21] early nineties,

[01:51:22] when I did some back country skiing in the cat skills,

[01:51:26] we'd get a bunch of guys in a pickup truck.

[01:51:28] And one guy would be the designated driver for a couple of runs and then we'd

[01:51:32] switch,

[01:51:33] you know,

[01:51:33] and there's some that you can just drive a car up to the top of that pitch and

[01:51:38] then ski down and you get a ride back up.

[01:51:41] I've,

[01:51:42] I've got a couple spots and I never post them on Strava and I never geotagged

[01:51:48] them.

[01:51:48] And they're just,

[01:51:49] they're my epic little open cat skill ski zones.

[01:51:54] And like you said,

[01:51:54] yeah,

[01:51:54] they're not,

[01:51:55] you know,

[01:51:56] they're not summit down to trail head or wherever,

[01:52:00] but it's just enough to get some really fun,

[01:52:04] satisfying turns in.

[01:52:05] So a good mix of type one and type two fun,

[01:52:09] right?

[01:52:09] A nice proportion balance of the two.

[01:52:12] Yeah.

[01:52:13] So,

[01:52:14] yeah,

[01:52:14] yeah,

[01:52:14] they do exist.

[01:52:15] So Jamie with this,

[01:52:17] the film variable now,

[01:52:19] do you have any stats that you have?

[01:52:21] Like how many hours filmed,

[01:52:23] how many hours editing?

[01:52:24] Cause you know,

[01:52:25] both like with the podcast and stuff like that,

[01:52:27] I know,

[01:52:27] I know how it,

[01:52:28] how difficult it is to edit.

[01:52:29] And I couldn't even imagine editing a film that is 30 minutes long with

[01:52:34] countless hours and hours of footage.

[01:52:37] Do you have any kind of like stats of how many hours that you've recorded

[01:52:40] and stuff?

[01:52:41] I guess.

[01:52:43] I think,

[01:52:44] I think roughly between the 10 year,

[01:52:47] you know,

[01:52:48] 46 mountains plus,

[01:52:50] you know,

[01:52:50] some of the cat skill footage plus the interviews.

[01:52:54] Um,

[01:52:56] I don't know,

[01:52:57] maybe it's,

[01:52:58] I don't know,

[01:52:59] 30,

[01:53:00] 40 hours of footage.

[01:53:02] And so,

[01:53:03] yeah,

[01:53:04] the trick,

[01:53:04] but let's just,

[01:53:05] you know,

[01:53:06] let's call it 40 hours of footage.

[01:53:08] You know,

[01:53:09] there's 46 mountains.

[01:53:11] I'm trying to tell a story that covers 10 years and 46 mountains and get it

[01:53:17] down into,

[01:53:19] you know,

[01:53:19] the film is just under 30 minutes.

[01:53:21] Um,

[01:53:23] so yeah,

[01:53:24] you know,

[01:53:24] and I'm,

[01:53:26] you know,

[01:53:26] if I'm going to call myself a filmmaker,

[01:53:28] I'm,

[01:53:28] you know,

[01:53:28] I'm a newer filmmaker.

[01:53:29] So I,

[01:53:32] you know,

[01:53:32] along with archiving and going through all the footage,

[01:53:35] I am doing all the editing,

[01:53:37] the sound design.

[01:53:39] Um,

[01:53:41] is Doug doing anything?

[01:53:42] My God.

[01:53:43] Doug is not.

[01:53:44] He's out skiing.

[01:53:45] This is my project.

[01:53:47] Um,

[01:53:48] yeah.

[01:53:48] So I probably spent,

[01:53:50] um,

[01:53:50] a good two months,

[01:53:53] August and September,

[01:53:54] just sitting in a chair,

[01:53:56] eight to 10 hours a day editing,

[01:53:59] you know,

[01:54:00] and then showing some of the early cuts to a few,

[01:54:03] a few folks that,

[01:54:04] that I value their opinion.

[01:54:07] And yeah,

[01:54:08] it's,

[01:54:08] it's,

[01:54:09] it's literally been a full time.

[01:54:11] I mean,

[01:54:11] between the,

[01:54:12] the skiing that,

[01:54:13] you know,

[01:54:13] Doug and I moved up to the Adirondacks for six weeks last winter and then coming back

[01:54:18] and then traveling around in July,

[01:54:20] uh,

[01:54:21] interviewing people.

[01:54:22] And then August 1st,

[01:54:23] I sat down and started editing the film.

[01:54:26] Um,

[01:54:27] and,

[01:54:28] you know,

[01:54:28] even today,

[01:54:29] even though I screened it the other week,

[01:54:30] I still sat down and made a couple edits before I,

[01:54:34] I sent it off to Lake Placid today.

[01:54:36] And those,

[01:54:37] Oh shit moments.

[01:54:38] You're like,

[01:54:38] Oh damn.

[01:54:39] Yeah.

[01:54:39] There's just,

[01:54:40] you know,

[01:54:40] it's the thing when you have,

[01:54:41] when I know just enough to be dangerous.

[01:54:43] And since I'm doing everything,

[01:54:45] I can get in there and noodle.

[01:54:47] And that's also the challenge when you're doing a project like this,

[01:54:50] you could edit and edit and edit.

[01:54:52] I could edit for,

[01:54:53] you know,

[01:54:54] a year straight,

[01:54:55] but at some point you just have to,

[01:54:57] um,

[01:54:58] you just have to pull the plug and say like,

[01:55:01] you know what?

[01:55:01] It's good enough with all the warts and,

[01:55:04] you know,

[01:55:05] everything about,

[01:55:06] you know,

[01:55:07] the film.

[01:55:07] It's just,

[01:55:08] you need to put it out there.

[01:55:10] And,

[01:55:10] um,

[01:55:11] you know,

[01:55:11] and that's when we screened it in Rochester,

[01:55:14] um,

[01:55:15] the Adirondack,

[01:55:16] uh,

[01:55:16] Western New York,

[01:55:17] uh,

[01:55:18] ADK hiking club had invited Doug and I last spring to be speakers.

[01:55:22] They do a monthly speaker series.

[01:55:25] So they had invited us to be speakers for November.

[01:55:27] So we were always going to be presenting.

[01:55:29] They didn't know that I had a film in the works and we showed up and on the

[01:55:36] drive over to the screening.

[01:55:38] Um,

[01:55:40] my brother asked how many people I was hoping would be there.

[01:55:44] And I said,

[01:55:44] I,

[01:55:45] you know,

[01:55:45] 50 would be nice because it's,

[01:55:47] uh,

[01:55:47] it was at the auditorium of the Rochester museum and science center,

[01:55:51] you know,

[01:55:51] in 50,

[01:55:51] I'm like,

[01:55:51] I just don't want this auditorium to feel empty and I'll take 50 people.

[01:55:57] We had just under 200 people show up for the film.

[01:56:02] They ran out of seats and people were standing in the back and yeah,

[01:56:07] it was a,

[01:56:08] it was a great like first opening,

[01:56:10] uh,

[01:56:11] first screening for the film and,

[01:56:13] um,

[01:56:14] had a really nice positive response to it.

[01:56:16] So,

[01:56:17] yeah,

[01:56:18] I mean,

[01:56:18] I'm excited to,

[01:56:19] to share it,

[01:56:20] uh,

[01:56:21] with,

[01:56:21] with more folks around here and just bring it around,

[01:56:24] um,

[01:56:24] the Northeast this winter.

[01:56:26] Awesome.

[01:56:27] Well,

[01:56:27] I,

[01:56:27] well,

[01:56:28] I watched,

[01:56:28] uh,

[01:56:29] what you sent over to Stash and I,

[01:56:31] and I thought it was excellent.

[01:56:32] And I encourage anyone who has some level of interest or no interest in backcountry skiing

[01:56:38] still to go out and see it because it,

[01:56:40] it's all beautiful scenery and really gives you a flavor of the challenge that this is.

[01:56:47] Yeah.

[01:56:47] I think,

[01:56:48] I think,

[01:56:49] you know,

[01:56:50] there are plenty of ski films out there that,

[01:56:53] you know,

[01:56:54] a lot of films that come out from the West,

[01:56:56] uh,

[01:56:56] you know,

[01:56:57] out in the Rockies and out West,

[01:56:58] you know,

[01:56:59] people skiing,

[01:57:00] amazing terrain,

[01:57:01] dropping big cliffs,

[01:57:03] you know,

[01:57:03] taking helicopters,

[01:57:04] you know,

[01:57:04] skiing all this amazing stuff,

[01:57:06] stuff that I would love to ski.

[01:57:08] This is not one of those films.

[01:57:10] Um,

[01:57:11] you know,

[01:57:11] this is a film that's rooted in what it's like to ski here in New York state and the Adirondacks.

[01:57:17] Um,

[01:57:18] you know,

[01:57:19] the film definitely dips into the history of skiing in New York state and the Adirondacks and why it's different, uh,

[01:57:27] why backcountry skiing is different than what it is in New Hampshire or Maine,

[01:57:33] because we have different laws here that govern what can happen in the wilderness.

[01:57:37] Um,

[01:57:38] and yeah,

[01:57:39] I think I tried to bring a little bit more of a,

[01:57:42] um,

[01:57:43] sort of a narrative arc to the,

[01:57:45] the film as well,

[01:57:46] just to really kind of like show our,

[01:57:49] our,

[01:57:50] just our entire journey and how it was affected in different ways.

[01:57:54] So it's,

[01:57:56] it's way,

[01:57:56] it's way different than the Colorado stuff because the Colorado stuff is six feet of powder shit like that.

[01:58:02] They don't have to deal with massive amounts of ice.

[01:58:05] Well,

[01:58:05] in Colorado and Western skiing,

[01:58:09] you don't have to deal with like a picket fence of trees in front of you.

[01:58:16] Okay.

[01:58:16] Exactly.

[01:58:17] You can actually,

[01:58:18] you have a lot of open terrain to ski in without worrying about getting your eye poked out or falling into a spruce trap.

[01:58:26] Yeah.

[01:58:27] again,

[01:58:27] I've skied all over out West and I've skied extensively in the Northeast.

[01:58:32] I really don't get my arms around skiing from the summit of any of these.

[01:58:38] Well,

[01:58:38] some of the mountains in the Catskills,

[01:58:40] I'll say,

[01:58:40] okay,

[01:58:40] it's,

[01:58:41] it's very skiable,

[01:58:42] but to set out to do all of them like you,

[01:58:45] Doug and Julia McGuire did.

[01:58:47] I think that's just insane.

[01:58:49] My hat's off to you guys because it's quite,

[01:58:51] it's quite the challenge.

[01:58:53] I don't care what other challenge you try to do when the Catskills or the Adirondacks,

[01:58:57] but this is like right up there.

[01:58:59] I guess the only thing like more hardcore than this would be able to,

[01:59:02] to do it naked.

[01:59:04] Jesus.

[01:59:05] That's a whole different story.

[01:59:07] Oh man.

[01:59:08] The Rangers would be called.

[01:59:09] That'll be Stosh.

[01:59:11] Stosh,

[01:59:11] you could be the first person to ski all 3,500 mountains over 3,500 on skis.

[01:59:18] Do it on a snowboard.

[01:59:20] That'll be,

[01:59:20] that'll be freaking the Rangers will be like,

[01:59:23] ah,

[01:59:23] God,

[01:59:23] that naked dude needs another rescue up on freaking Cheryl.

[01:59:26] God damn.

[01:59:28] Just don't fall.

[01:59:29] Yeah.

[01:59:30] All right.

[01:59:30] Well,

[01:59:30] Jamie,

[01:59:31] thanks a lot for joining us tonight.

[01:59:32] I,

[01:59:32] I suggest anybody to watch the film variable.

[01:59:36] I'll have their links.

[01:59:37] I'll be posting something up on,

[01:59:39] on Facebook soon and Instagram.

[01:59:41] It's an Epic film,

[01:59:43] 30 minutes long,

[01:59:44] and it's actually absolutely amazing.

[01:59:46] But one more question.

[01:59:47] Last question.

[01:59:48] Post hike bruising bites.

[01:59:50] Where do you like to go in the Catskills after you've done an awesome ski

[01:59:53] in,

[01:59:54] in the Catskills or a hike in the Catskills?

[01:59:56] Doesn't matter.

[01:59:57] And,

[01:59:58] you know,

[01:59:59] I,

[01:59:59] I think,

[02:00:01] I think we've just leaned on Brio's plenty of times for that,

[02:00:05] like last minute pizza right before it closes.

[02:00:08] So,

[02:00:09] uh,

[02:00:10] I'm going to go with Brio's,

[02:00:11] but I'm also,

[02:00:12] you know,

[02:00:12] like these days,

[02:00:13] um,

[02:00:14] because I live near it and I just,

[02:00:16] it's open all day.

[02:00:18] I'm,

[02:00:18] I'm at the bread alone boys fell cafe all the time.

[02:00:22] Um,

[02:00:23] super awesome.

[02:00:24] Um,

[02:00:25] yeah,

[02:00:25] I go there.

[02:00:26] That's a good one after I'm done skiing and yeah,

[02:00:28] I really love what they do.

[02:00:30] So,

[02:00:31] um,

[02:00:31] yeah,

[02:00:32] uh,

[02:00:32] those are my,

[02:00:33] there's my two local spots that I hit up all the time.

[02:00:35] Nice.

[02:00:36] And Ted,

[02:00:37] I heard you have something that you went to,

[02:00:39] you,

[02:00:39] you sent me a video and it was absolutely insane.

[02:00:41] Yeah.

[02:00:42] So a few weeks ago I wandered and I've been there before,

[02:00:46] but I was looking for a cold beer to,

[02:00:49] to pull down after a hard day hiking.

[02:00:53] And I went into the Phoenicia market,

[02:00:55] which is not the same place as the gas station in Phoenicia.

[02:00:58] So part of your challenge here is to find the Phoenicia market in Phoenicia.

[02:01:04] Jamie,

[02:01:04] do you know where it is?

[02:01:06] Well,

[02:01:07] and you went into the beer cave in the back,

[02:01:10] right?

[02:01:10] Yes.

[02:01:10] Yes.

[02:01:10] I even have it down here as the beer cave.

[02:01:12] Okay.

[02:01:13] I mean,

[02:01:13] I haven't been in there a long time,

[02:01:15] but I was surprised when I walked through the quote unquote market and into

[02:01:20] the beer cave because it was a pretty good,

[02:01:21] pretty good.

[02:01:23] Yeah.

[02:01:23] It's like,

[02:01:24] it's like the diamond in the rough.

[02:01:26] And so the only thing I'll add to that is the,

[02:01:28] the beer cave is remarkable for this hole in the wall supermarket that

[02:01:34] probably most of the items on sale.

[02:01:37] There are outdated.

[02:01:39] That's just my opinion.

[02:01:40] I'm not slandering the business at all in any way,

[02:01:43] but,

[02:01:44] but I will say if you want like a quick,

[02:01:47] uh,

[02:01:48] you know,

[02:01:48] beer selection and snack,

[02:01:50] they sell these.

[02:01:51] It's on the unique,

[02:01:52] uh,

[02:01:53] pretzels.

[02:01:54] Unique is the company and these hard pretzels,

[02:01:57] man,

[02:01:57] they're good.

[02:01:57] So actually last week I brought home two bags for my wife and I,

[02:02:01] and we had post hike pretzel and bruise.

[02:02:06] Here at the house.

[02:02:08] Nice.

[02:02:08] Yeah.

[02:02:09] So nice.

[02:02:10] Jamie was a wonderful chatting with you.

[02:02:12] It's quite a epic thing you did.

[02:02:14] And I'm looking forward to whatever your next challenges.

[02:02:19] And,

[02:02:19] uh,

[02:02:20] you know,

[02:02:20] once again,

[02:02:21] check out his film variable.

[02:02:22] I'll have posts about it through and through of everything.

[02:02:25] And there was also,

[02:02:26] once again,

[02:02:26] his screenings has happened.

[02:02:28] New Paltz Saturday,

[02:02:29] January 11th,

[02:02:30] 2025 at the rock and snow at 7 PM.

[02:02:33] And then Hunter,

[02:02:34] uh,

[02:02:35] the doctoral center for the arts.

[02:02:37] Is that correct?

[02:02:37] The mountain cinema.

[02:02:39] So I'll be posting that up.

[02:02:40] I will probably be at that one.

[02:02:42] So the January 23rd and Hunter.

[02:02:45] So I'll post that up.

[02:02:46] So once again,

[02:02:47] Jamie,

[02:02:48] thank you for joining us on the show.

[02:02:50] Right.

[02:02:50] Really appreciate it.

[02:02:51] Uh,

[02:02:52] thank you to the monthly supporters and monthly sponsors.

[02:02:54] Really appreciate you guys.

[02:02:55] Supporting the show.

[02:02:56] Uh,

[02:02:56] thank you to everyone who is still listening.

[02:02:58] 150 episodes.

[02:02:59] Uh,

[02:03:00] crazy that we've gone this far.

[02:03:02] Almost three years.

[02:03:03] So,

[02:03:03] yeah,

[02:03:03] thank you.

[02:03:04] Have a good night,

[02:03:05] Jamie.

[02:03:05] And we'll,

[02:03:05] we'll chat later.

[02:03:06] We'll keep in touch,

[02:03:07] man.

[02:03:08] Thanks guys.

[02:03:08] I appreciate it.

[02:03:09] It was great chatting.

[02:03:12] Hi everyone.

[02:03:13] I just want to thank you for listening to the show.

[02:03:16] If you enjoyed the show,

[02:03:18] subscribe and throw down a smooth review on Spotify,

[02:03:22] Apple podcasts,

[02:03:24] or any podcast platform.

[02:03:25] That you use.

[02:03:27] You can also check daily updates of the podcast,

[02:03:31] hikes,

[02:03:32] hiking news,

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[02:03:37] and the official website of the show.

[02:03:40] Remember this,

[02:03:41] you got to just keep on living in the Catskills,

[02:03:45] man.

[02:03:46] M-I-V-I-N-E.

[02:03:49] Wicked,

[02:03:50] wicked,

[02:03:51] wicked,

[02:03:51] wicked.