Episode 229 - 35 Peaks, One Attempt, But a Different Ending with Alex Raimo

[00:00:29] The bushwhacks were some of the worst days I've ever had in the mountains, or life, really. Whereas Pantsy Mountain is totally opposite, it's a mountain on top of a crater. I think the weather challenges on this incident were particularly difficult. It is really the development of New York State. Catskills will respond to it.

[00:00:52] Passing into Inside The Line, the Catskill Mountains Podcast. Alright, so episode 229 tonight. Alex Raimo, did I say that correct? Yes sir.

[00:01:17] Ah yes, joins us tonight to talk about his attempt on the Catskill 3500 in one hike. One frickin' hike to do all the 3500. It's been done before, it's been I think twice done before, and Alex I attempted to do this, we've talked about it before, and unfortunately ran into some crazy ass situations going up over the Devil's Path of course, and everything gets disrupted with the Devil's Path.

[00:01:44] And he's here to chat about it tonight, and it's great to have you on Alex. Welcome to the show, good to have you, good to see you buddy. I really appreciate it, thanks guys. Yeah, yeah, let's have some frickin' fun. First of all, you're not dead, so that's a good thing. Yeah, totally. Like, could you call us a few close calls? We'll talk about it on Hawk It, but it was fun. Nice, and to think that it was on Hawk It. I know. But hey. No, I guess we need new t-shirts.

[00:02:13] I survived Hawk It. Right? Yeah. I like that. I like that. So, I want to start this thing off by the, it's been going around, it's been hitting the social media platforms that this woman, her name was, oh God, I forgot her name.

[00:02:35] I should have this all written down, but Eb something, an influencer comes into Tannersville and starts bashing the Topps Tannersville store. The grocery store, the only grocery store that's located basically in Hunter in Tannersville. And she starts, you know, judging everything that's going on in there. This produce, this meat, this stuff starts like panning out. It's like, I can't believe I'm here.

[00:03:04] And I was, I was, I'm not shocked because we'll go back. She's says, she based herself out of the NYC, of course. But she came from Minnesota. She came from a small town in Minnesota. So, I don't see why any of this, you know, I watched the video several times, which is unfortunate. But the good thing is it wasn't her video, so I didn't make her even more famous.

[00:03:30] But she has like a million viewers and stuff like that, or a million followers, which is crazy. And she's wearing a Montauk shirt, so she really doesn't know shit about the mountains. But anyway, she's just going around and looking around like, oh my God, I can't believe you're here. How are we going to survive off of four days of this? And in the beginning, I'm just like, like, I get all fired up and I'm just like, listen, you have not, this is not a small store, number one.

[00:03:58] Number two, just imagine Tad, if she went to like Phoenicia or even like, like Wyndham. Like, I mean, Wyndham's not bad. Okay, let me start off. Let's, let's say if she went to Wyndham or Phoenicia, like Wyndham's fine because they have that, that's, oh, what's it called? Oh, what's that Wyndham store? That's like top notch stuff. The Getty station. I mean, I don't know what's in Wyndham. There's this gas station, Hickory Hills.

[00:04:26] They have Hickory Hills, which is like, like good stuff. But then you go down to Phoenicia and what do you got down there? A gas? No, well, you have the grocery store in Phoenicia. It's got the best beer cave in the Catskills. Okay. So I don't, I don't think tops has really good beer. Okay. They do. They have amazing hard ciders. What are you talking about? You ever been in there? I said, beer, I said, I don't think they have really good beer.

[00:04:51] And if I went there, I wouldn't know a hard cider from a Macintosh apple, but you know, where else in the Catskills inside the line to keep it relevant? Is there a grocery store that's part of a chain like tops, wagons, price chopper, stop and shop, but Hannaford's where's another one? There isn't. So, you know, I get, I used to in the old days, I used to do a lot of hitchhiking on

[00:05:20] my, uh, my hikes and I get picked up, picked up by locals and they would tell me that they're like on their way to Kingston to go grocery shopping. That's where they go. Yep. They, they drive out of the Catskills. They go to Kingston to go grocery shopping. So yeah, you've got a tops market in Tannersville. It doesn't have the best of selection, but it's, I think the term is a food desert, but there's

[00:05:46] no food really in the Catskills of the average typical variety that you're going to get at another urban area, but that's what makes the Catskills fun. You gotta, you gotta, you know, make do with what you got. I mean, she could have went to a grocery or a gas station. That's probably the only other place you're going to get shit. Like, uh, well, I mean, there's, there's places where you can find interesting stuff to buy in the Catskills.

[00:06:12] I know local goods has a lot of esoteric cheeses and snacks and beers and presumably hard ciders. There's actually, I take it back. There is a grocery store, a really good grocery store in downtown Woodstock. Uh, there is it's the market. Yep. Yeah. They have a great, uh, selection of organic vegetarian and vegan foods there. Um, you know, it's well stocked, well run.

[00:06:41] So that's kind of like the unique animal, but so here she is. She's out judging the Catskills, the store just based upon this one visit. She has a million followers and that kind of seems to be what sells. That's what people are into these days. You know? Oh, she got, she got destroyed though. Yeah. But how'd she get a million followers? If this is her content. That was, that was before. I don't know. I didn't, I didn't look at it.

[00:07:06] There are other stuff, but I just know that she got like, she got bashed and she like, did an, like an apology and stuff like that. And people still bashed her up. And it's just, you know, being, you know, you, you've been around Tad, um, and you know, we've traveled, but I went to Yosemite. We had a place that, uh, was called three rivers.

[00:07:27] We stopped at the grocery store on a Sunday evening and we, I, I, I, we had three days worth of replies and the cost was near $200 for three days. And you and the miss, you guys had caviar. Yeah. Okay. Right. Isn't that what you guys are buying? Yeah. Ham and chicken, turkey sandwiches, uh, eggs, bacon, sausages, like milk, yogurt.

[00:07:57] Like this is the normal stuff, but you know, it's, it's in the middle of nowhere that the population of the town is like 200. So they can skyrocket those prices with the tourists in there. You know what? And you know, I was fine with that. I'm just like, yeah, we can live off of this. I wasn't going in there and it was like, oh my God, they don't have organic lettuce. I'm done. I'm done with this place. I'm documenting this taste and I'm blessed. I'm like, I really don't give a shit. I can eat. That's fine with me. I'm just, just as long as I can freaking hike. Yeah.

[00:08:23] But apparently she went to the Catskills for the wrong reasons on July 4th. Nonetheless. Yeah. Well, I think one of the, uh, arts good living is knowing how to rough it. Yeah. And then Alex knows about that though. Yeah. Oh yeah. Just a bit. Nothing crazy though. Were you going to stop at tops and grab some like, like eight hearts? Hard siders and down them to boost your energy on the last push. You know, I thought about it.

[00:08:50] I think it would be best for like my timeline, but maybe next time. Next time. Yeah. You know, and that can't, that's gotta be unsupported. So I can't, I can't drop you off anywhere or something and drive you and give you some beer. So not true. Yeah. Damn. So, so wanted to, wanted to bring that up. I find the tops place. Great. Great. It has great selection of like everything. And it also has a, a well working bathroom.

[00:09:16] So that's, that's also good for me too, as well, of course, but they have a great selection of hard cider and stuff. Like they have a whole island of it. So Todd went there and bought me some stuff before. Uh, and he bought himself like, like $200 worth, which is fantastic. But, uh, but yeah, he was, he was, he, they have a great selection of local beer. So if you, if you were in the Tannersville area, stop at tops and get that selection of like locals, they have IPA. Yeah. Everything.

[00:09:45] Do they let you camp out in their parking lot? I mean, I, maybe I'll go in and get, you know, a couple six packs and just pitch a tent out in the parking lot, a cooler, a couple of bags of ice. Yeah. I can't, I can't go hiking. I'm on, you know, I can just hang out in the tops parking lot. Sounds like a party. Yeah. I was gonna say a live stream. People can swing by, hang out with me. I will join you on that. Yeah. Like what the hell? Nice.

[00:10:12] I mean, if, if you do that though, do you, you could also, you know, one to one thing to integrate, they have internet there. So a cool thing that we're gonna integrate this into a little, bring this into is that, uh, that there was a planning or approval of a big Indian tower over in the Shandaken area, big Indian area, all of Ray area. So, uh, they're putting a cell tower up in the big Indian, all of Ray fire department area, addressing a service gap.

[00:10:41] And it will provide service with Verizon within 0.4 miles of the firehouse. Uh, uh, customers and carriers would be able to use their service again for 911 calls, Verizon set. And, uh, it's just, it's, they, they mentioned that on the, the zoning thing. This came from overlook. Uh, what is it? Uh, the overlook. It's a little, uh, news column in the Catskills area. Very awesome stuff like that.

[00:11:07] Um, and they said, uh, the Verizon tower is less than a third than most usual towers. Um, it will be fenced in and stuff like that. And it'll provide a much needed service gap towards the area of like, if we're going to talk mountains ways, we're going to talk Panther, you know, slide area going up that way.

[00:11:28] Balsam then we're going to shoot down South, uh, well East, it would be like, uh, Panther, the arms of Panther, Wittenberg, Shandaken, and then up North towards the Bel Air area, pine Hill, stuff like that. So, I mean, that's, that's pretty cool. It's good to see, um, tad, you had some stats on this, that, uh, how tall it is and stuff. Yeah. So typically your cell phone towers are between 140 feet to just shy at 200 feet.

[00:11:58] The reason they generally don't go above 200 feet is, uh, for federal aviation regulations. They now have to get lit a different way when they're 200 feet or higher. This, this tower is significant because it's roughly one third of the, that lower average. It's 50 feet. How noticeable will it be? Maybe not all that noticeable, but it is kind of in a prominent area right at that intersection. Yep.

[00:12:25] And I will say it's no surprise that Verizon came in and picked the local fire department for this location because under your typical zoning laws, the minute you put up a radio tower for emergency communication, the level of local municipal review goes down. All the thresholds and standards go down.

[00:12:53] So you will see very often, uh, local DPWs, local fire departments, local police agencies and townships reaching agreement with a cellular provider like Verizon to put a tower on that municipal site. And on the tower is going to be a couple antenna for local emergency communications.

[00:13:21] And, you know, it's, it's good. It's critical. You know, we've back, back when I first started hiking, I participated in a, like, uh, I wouldn't say a local event, uh, a little, uh, I'm trying to think of the word like experiment. Where they put up balloons down in the cat or the plat clove area to show where a simulation of a fire tower would be, or a fire tower, a cell tower would be.

[00:13:50] And, you know, we would be, I was up on hunter mountain and there was people up on Indian head, cat or skill high peak and stuff to see, you know, the visibility of it because, you know, there's, there's self-service needed down in the plat clove area. And, uh, up somewhat, you know, and it was really cool. You know, I, I didn't from hunter even zooming in, this was like. God 10 years ago. So even zooming in with my cell phone for camera, you could barely see the balloons that they had up.

[00:14:20] They were bright red, yellow, and blue to simulate the different heights that they had. And, uh, you know, that would have been a much needed area, which they haven't. I mean, I've, I'm pretty sure. No, they haven't installed one over in that way area, but you know, they never, they never did that over in the beginning. And, but once again, there's that big gap pushing up into the olive ray area that you have. And yeah, I'm pretty sure like when I'm, I'm just exiting the top, going onto the ridge of giant ledge, I can get service.

[00:14:49] And, but down in that area, there's nothing, there's absolutely nothing. Once you get beyond like a McKinley hollow, it starts to drop out. So who knows if it will still be up there and stuff when you're at the high peaks, you can basically get service almost anywhere. It's crazy. And it's, and it's cool. But like, once again, this helps out with the good old giant ledge area that receives rescues all the time.

[00:15:17] Slide area that receives rescues get more pinpoint of a location of where these people might need to serve help and stuff. And it helps out the fire department, the fire department usually besides the Rangers are the first ones to react and to be on the scene. Like I know a lot of these instances of where that the fire department is the first one to be there. I'm pretty sure Kate said that, right? The, one of the guys from the fire department from big India was up there first. Yeah. That's what I seem to recall. But I, Stash, I think you're really looking at this from the wrong perspective.

[00:15:47] Because they're put that tower up where they're putting it up. Not because of hikers. They're putting that tower there because of the skiers go into Belair, right? Because they, they lose signal on their way to Belair. Could you imagine that you're a father? You got your three kids in the van. You're driving to Belair to go skiing, right? And all of a sudden like your kids lose their cellular connection. Oh yeah. Yeah. It's true.

[00:16:17] All the grumbling and whining where you're on your way home and you want to put like a food order in, right? You want to like, maybe, you know, get some app and pick up some fancy food over at tops market and Tannersville where they got all the good stuff. I don't know, maybe some ciders from over there, but that's, there's the big gap in coverage there. And it's really, I think it's for all the skier traffic that goes through there is what's prompting it because yeah, there's, there's cell towers that hit Belair.

[00:16:46] But once those people leave the parking lot and start heading east on 28, they're out of coverage really quick. And you don't, for me, I really don't pick up coverage again until I hit Boyceville. Yeah. And my, my, my usual routine is I pull over in Boyceville and just stop and I'll call my wife because once I bang a left on 28 or a right on 28 a I'm out of coverage, you know, in a few miles. So I just pull over and, you know, tell my wife I'm on my way home. What not.

[00:17:16] But now, now I can, you know, now I can hang at the town park at big Indian. Yeah. Right. They have all that fat fancy statuary over there. Have you ever seen that? I have, I have. And they also have good bathrooms there. Oh, really? I don't know. That's when you're looking, when you're looking for a place to have like a, a meet and greet for the podcast, there is a spot right there in big Indian. That's true. First of all, the name we're, we're hooking up at big Indian that in and of itself sounds cool.

[00:17:45] You're right there on the sofa. So fish, you have all that cool stuff. And now like this time next year, you're gonna have this big ass cell tower. You know, I can do it full on live. Yeah. We can do like, you know, uh, stories and reels and post instantly. Why not? Yeah. And Alex will be running through doing his diartissima. Yeah. And we'll just be like, yeah, we'll just be like, and then he's gone. Yeah. He's like, oh, this is downhill. You cannot catch me. I cannot stop. I'm going, I'm completely going.

[00:18:16] So that's pretty cool. Good, good thing to hear. So, um, and then, then we get onto this beautiful thing that happens somewhat. Um, women dog rescues out of the good old fawn sleep area. So on, uh, and it looks like July 11th, 2026, of course, a woman or dog were saved after becoming trapped out of treacherous swimming hole in the Catskills, as we know as fall fleet.

[00:18:45] So, uh, Wednesday, um, last week around 7 PM, a woman and her dog were stranded on the ledge and they had, she had attempted to rescue her dog after it was swept over the 24 foot waterfall. Swimming out of the base of the falls, she became stranded herself. And according to the twin clothes rescue team, uh, twin, once again, this is a, yeah, this is a tongue twister twin clothes, technical rescue team, assistant chief, Michael Advino.

[00:19:15] Uh, the rescue took two and a half hours and members of the Greentowny Sheriff's office, Athens and Hudson fire departments, with water rescue teams, position themselves downstream while the technical team and the state forest rangers repelled about 80 feet from the top of the falls to reach a woman and her dog. Uh, despite the wheel deal, they were not injured. And, uh, the team at those of the twin clothes has already conducted rescues twice this year.

[00:19:40] And this is the first time, uh, they have to rescue ever rescued a dog. Um, of course we all know that pounds leap is popular for swimming and stuff. And I believe last year, Tad was the year that that kid got swept over and unfortunately passed away. And the current got swept up in the undercurrent, the undertow and stuff like that. So this is a popular area to go swimming. I have never been there. I've walked by there going up there, but I've never been swimming in there.

[00:20:08] But this is, uh, seems to be once again, I mean, we're in social media times. I guarantee this happened in the past before, as we know, but, um, as we think, but I mean, I just, why do you take your dogs to fall and leap? Right. Yeah. I mean, who knows if this person had been there before and was, uh, familiar with what she was going to encounter.

[00:20:34] And maybe we can compare a fawn's leap and your experience going there versus Catterskill falls, uh, Catterskill falls has been largely domesticated. Right. Yeah. And improved. And, you know, uh, a lot of the risk associated with going there 50 years ago has been reduced, if not eliminated. But then you see people that are posting, uh, about fawn's leap, which is not receive that

[00:21:04] level of domestication. And so maybe she thought it was more like Catterskill falls. She goes over there. Next thing you know, her dog is going over the edge or down some rock slope and she has to go after her dog, you know, it's sad, but thankfully these volunteers, the local volunteers are well-trained, well-equipped. They take their job seriously. And whether it's a human or a dog or a human and a dog, they get out there and they do their thing. Yeah.

[00:21:34] And they do it once again, mostly besides the Rangers are all volunteers. So like these guys, the twin clothes teams are amazing professionals at what they do. If you saw the picture on there, they have multiple like pull lines and stuff and multiple repelling systems and anchor points and stuff. It was, it was cool to look, to look at the picture and being at the point of search and rescue and knowing how these, I mean, Tad, you, you know, you were, you were on boats and stuff.

[00:22:02] The whole, the, the rope systems, the anchors, the pulleys that they had to do to get a woman out. And then the dog, you know, it's, it's, it's very, it's very technical and it takes time. No wonder like people like two and a half hours. That's ridiculous. No. Yeah. And it's also not something where when you show up, you're going to like spend a lot of time trying to figure it out and coordinate. These people do a lot of training in advance.

[00:22:27] So when they're in a situation like this, they, they can work in a high level of efficiency, coordinating their efforts to do what they do in a safe manner. Yeah. So, I mean, frankly, when's the, when's the last time you heard a rescue like this went bad? Uh, I mean, it doesn't, doesn't, doesn't come to mind. Right. Yeah. So the only time I'm thinking the last time that it went bad was like a recovery over in

[00:22:53] black clove with a twin clove had to be, be helped out. But other than that, like, you know, these, these rescues are super cool and I, I guarantee it's, it's horrible, but it's super fun to watch. Like, like it's just multiple people anchoring, lifted, lowering down someone to there and to pick them up to pull them back up or the person to play. It's just, it's cool as heck. Yeah. You know, who's trained in high rope rescue like that? My daughter. Oh, nice.

[00:23:23] Yeah. She, um, when she got into technical rock climbing. Uh, one of the things she asked me and I signed her up for it was, you know, these, uh, technical rescue courses. Cause if her and her partner are out climbing someplace and you know, they, they need to self rescue or rescue somebody else out of a situation. Sometimes you don't have 45 minutes or an hour to wait for help to come in. Sometimes you can't get a signal out to get help.

[00:23:52] So yeah, that was kind of an essential for her. Yeah. That's good. Alex with, with your like experience. I know you, you, you send me this, these, these pictures of you being on Mount Whitney and it looked like, like Colorado high peaks. Like, are you like, have you trained yourself self-taught or you've been in any trainings and like these kind of like technical rope situations? Not at all. No, I don't do anything technical. He's our kind of guy.

[00:24:20] The fricking guy sends me a picture of, of him on like near the summit of Mount Whitney at 1 AM in the morning. And I'm like, what the hell is this? That was awesome. That was awesome. I mean, there's, there's, there's, there's, there's, what was the weather? What was the weather? Like. It was about 10 degrees, but I chose 1 AM because it's gonna be warmer than like 5 AM when it's gonna go to like below zero. So. Oh really? Yeah. That's crazy. That's awesome. So, I mean, doing that, I mean, you're, you, you, you're, you're well prepared for any situation in the mountains.

[00:24:49] It seems like. That was really hard. That was really hard. Yeah. I mean, if we could get into that later, then that would be kind of like your training for this. Awesome. Awesome. So, Ted, so there was a kayak water recovery. Do you want to cover this? No, you can do it. You're doing okay, man. Well, thank you. You're just, you're just blitzing right through these. So. About this, uh, kayak situation. Notice it's a recovery and not a rescue. Correct.

[00:25:18] So, uh, unfortunately in Sullivan County on July 4th, 9 07 PA, uh, PM, uh, our man, forest ranger, Russia responded to a report of a missing kayaker, Monga pond campground. The kayak was located, but the 56 year old kayaker from pine Island was not the Southern County, Sullivan County dive team searched the water while rangers Russia and strand and research the shore. They continued until 1 30 AM.

[00:25:45] And at 7 AM, the search resumed with five rangers, New York state police and the Sullivan County dive team, Sullivan County's sheriff deputies and limits in the manner EMS. At 11 28 AM. The next day, the Sullivan County dive team located the kayakers. They ceased in the middle of Monga pond. The subject was turned over the county corner. So. Yeah. That's a sad ending. Yeah, definitely. Definitely. It's a, yeah.

[00:26:11] You need, you need to wonder, um, was this fellow wearing, you know, a personal flotation device, a life, a life vest or something like that. True. Yeah. I mean, July 4th was, I remember was a nice day where they just out there without any safety gear on and then something bad happened and you know, they didn't have the equipment on to keep their head above water. Yeah. So who knows?

[00:26:37] That's, that's a sad situation, but you know, if you're going to go out and do something like that, good idea to wear flotation equipment. Yeah. Safety, safety, safety. Even if you, you look goofy, like who cares? You know, once again, this guy could have just stayed afloat for that long until he was rescued. But unfortunately, once again, thank you to Russia and Stratton of course. And thank you to everybody who helped out with the, uh, the New York state police dive

[00:27:04] team, Sullivan County sheriff deputies and the live in the manner EMS. So unfortunate. Unfortunately, it's an so, uh, all right. That's it for shooting the shit. Ooh, that's good. That's a new one. That's it for shooting the shit. Um, so let's continue on with the amazing sponsors or our amazing supporters like Chris

[00:27:28] Garbian, Eric Rosario, Jeff shots, Vicki Ferrer, Mikey S, Henry Burr, Burmeister, John Comiskey, Oscana Nichols, desert city radio, new man, my buddy, David Oliver, that's the a Denise W. Vanessa and Jim C. Thank you guys so much, very much for supporting the show. Once again, I like to say this all the time. You're not just supporting the show. You're supporting the cat skills. We take this money that we get from the podcast and put it right back in the cat skills. We got to do that soon.

[00:27:58] So, uh, also amazing sponsors like outdoor Chronicles photography, Molly from outdoor Chronicles photography specializes in adventure. Elopment and adventure couple photography in the Catskills, Adirondacks and the white mountains. She's an officiant for getting married a license guide, but most importantly, she is a story maker. Molly won't just give you photos. She'll give you memories that will last forever. Don't hesitate to get ahold of Molly on all platforms.

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[00:28:55] Check them out on the website and all social media platforms. All right. So what are you guys having a drink tonight? Let's let's pop open these things. These things. Is that what you call them? I guess so. I'll have one of these things. These things. Yeah, sorry. All right. I have a great poppy. I don't know if this is actually covered the brand.

[00:29:21] No, I not at all pick up an alcoholic beverage, but this is what I have. Hey, crack it open in the mic. I see the mic right there. Nice. Oh yeah. That came through. So. Tad, you're up. Yeah. I'm going to try. This is kind of hard, but we'll get it. Oh. Yeah. What's that? All right.

[00:29:47] I have, I have a devil's path IPA. So. Isn't that your favorite? One of your favorite besides the. Yeah. Yeah. Julie McGuire. Julie McGuire is the one who raves about this.

[00:30:04] So, you know, last year I forget when I had my first one and it's kind of been almost like a standard for me to when I want to an IPA that's got that nice balance of, you know, hops and bitter and beer flavor. And it's got that bad ass, you know, devil's path logo on it. True. Yeah. This is, this is what I'm doing. Nice. Nice.

[00:30:32] Well, everybody loves when I do that. Yeah. That was. That's a good one. Yeah. All right. Let me, that is of course a Hudson North peach mango hard cider delicious. God's delicious. Um, so yeah, that's, that's, that's good everybody. So how about, uh, so this section is, uh, for Alex is called, are you really outdoors?

[00:31:02] So you mentioned the podcast on one of your hikes through social media and we'll chat about this show. Tag us by typing at itl catskill MTM podcast on your social media post. We didn't see anything from Alex. So we're just like, he's gone from the show right now. Done. He's out of here. But first, um, we'd like to send our condolences to Todd's bold father, uh, Papa bold recently passed away.

[00:31:29] Um, definitely was a super cool guy. Uh, as, as we looked at it, if you, if you follow Todd from the, from our podcast, he tags the podcast a lot. His dad was awesome. He hiked in jeans. So I guarantee his only source of, uh, of, uh, hydration was good old six pack in his backpack.

[00:31:51] And, um, so, um, Todd, you know, we send our condolences and, uh, once again, hopefully your father is up there watching you knock off all these high peaks while having a full time job. Yeah. Looks like, looks like Todd had a really good teacher and salute to his father. Yeah. Yeah. Cheers. Cheers to him. Um, so once again, were you really outdoors?

[00:32:17] Uh, Tracy pink pony 18 was up on balsam and she posted a picture of the viewpoint that basically does not exist anymore. I mean, that really hits a nerve on me because balsam was my first high peak and the viewpoint was absolutely phenomenal. And now it's gone.

[00:32:36] And there is in the Catskill mass master plan, CMP that it recalls that you should, you should be making the viewpoints that are on the map still there. Nope, not there. So what, why can't the trail maintainer go over there and do that? Or the Catskill trail clue. Hmm. Good question. Very good question. Cause they probably got to get approval from the DEC. That's going to take five or six years.

[00:33:03] And then those trees are going to be over three inch, whatever they're called, uh, breast height or whatever. Well, but when you say that the, uh, the, uh, Catskill management plan permits these viewpoints to be maintained, I don't, I don't remember reading anywhere about some process or procedure to get permission to maintain them. It just said, you need to maintain them.

[00:33:24] So we already know that Alex likes to go hiking mountains late at night, just connecting the dots. Maybe Alex should go out there with some tree removal equipment, commonly known as chainsaws. And, you know, just kind of reestablish the viewpoint. I'll think about it for next time. He's going to take it under advisement. And the next time Alex is on the show, we won't ask him questions about viewpoint maintenance because we don't want him to incriminate himself.

[00:33:54] Yeah. You're already probably already packing lightweight. I don't think you can throw on a, uh, a chainsaw on that backpack. Can you? I don't think so. Well, it doesn't have to be on the backpack. It can be at the front. Oh, true. I'll bounce it out. Yeah. Because Alex is living presumably a healthy lifestyle and not drinking alcohol tonight. Um, his ability to operate heavy equipment's not impaired. Correct. Yeah. So maybe we should just wrap up the podcast.

[00:34:22] So Alex can, can get an early start on his, uh, activity. All right, moving along. So Brad Labernante did his first two Adirondack high peaks and giant Rocky and then knocked off cascade and Porter. So we have a lot of people from the Catskills moving on to the Adirondacks, but I love that they're still tagging us in this, which is, which is great. And it's, it's once again, influencing people to get up in the Adirondacks and experiences a whole different world than the Catskills. And I love that. So that's great to hear.

[00:34:52] So good job, Brad. Brad also Patrick, the trail scribe was out on bear plan and fly. Nice. He also chose some music that I don't remember what it was, but I said, nice music choice. I think it was, Oh no way. It was Alice in Chains. Yes. Oh, good. Good shit. Uh, Serena Marie did the great range traverse. And also you got to remember that she has a book out as well. So check that out as well. Great range traverse is not easy.

[00:35:20] I think it's like 20 miles and like 9,000, 10,000 feet of gain or something like that. It's, it's not easy. So they like to put themselves through fricking torture. So, um, Rachel Jean, the gypsie queen was out in the Catskills for four days, three nights and saw her first bear. So, uh, I really, Ted, do you remember her itinerary? Like if she, what she conquered?

[00:35:46] Uh, I can't say that I do because, um, starting in around the beginning of June, I kind of like tuned out of Instagram. True. I think my, I think my daily usage is, you know, the all time low is like five minutes a day. Oh, wow. I might, yeah, I might start ramping that up again. I don't know, but yeah, I did see her post with the bear.

[00:36:10] I didn't remember that up until then she had not seen a bear in the Catskills, but, uh, hopefully now that she had that first bear sighting, uh, she'll realize that. It's kind of really nothing to be nervous about. Yeah. They don't do much. Yeah. Kind of cool. So she had, and then it was during the hot time. So she had, she had a, a, a tough night, you know, when she had to deal with those high temperatures at night. That's not fun in a tent. Uh, so.

[00:36:38] Yeah, you say that, you say that, but if she was at a campground, one of the things I've seen recently and I've tried to. I don't think she was at a campground. She was out in the wild. Oh, backpacking. Yeah. Yeah. Good for her. But. She's hardcore. She's hardcore that gypsy queen. Yeah. She's starting to learn to like, I think Sean's, uh, teaching her to be like, you know, just, just fucking do the AT, just get it done. It could happen. It could. It could. She'll do a gourmet style though.

[00:37:06] You know, she's like a professional chef. So. I, I, I mean, I would want to be in that trail fam right away. Yeah. Right. No, no dehydrated meals for her. Yeah. Who wants chicken fajitas tonight? Whoosh. Yes. Um, Steve, environmentality was up on Hunter and then when did some of the escarpment with the gang, as we'll talk about later.

[00:37:27] Uh, a Andy, AKA Brown ski, uh, from the double chair podcast was out paddling on Lake Sabago and Harriman and then hike to suffer in bear mountain trail. Uh, New York state down, New York downstate 28 or which is David Perez will be on the show and in a week or so. Uh, was that what he's like, have a tough time, have a good time, uh, pronouncing this stash. And unfortunately, Tad, you kind of helped me out and, uh, Chrissy G helped me out too.

[00:37:57] So. Oh, shun a monk. That's kind of what I was going to say at first. Shun a monk. I mean, I live up in upstate where it's Oneonta where everybody would be on the onto or, uh, what was the other one? Uh, that we have, uh, we have, we have a, we have a couple weird ones up here. Like, uh, Oh, skin, skinny Atlas. It looks like skinny at skin adults or something like that. Skinny Atlas. So then Schenectady. Schenectady.

[00:38:26] So I think I would have done that. So I think I would have done well. So thanks. Thanks Tad though. And my shun a monk mountain. I don't want you to look bad. That's my job. Yeah. Make you look good. Um, also Jeff Johnson, Orla was up on Burton. I'm checking out the blackheads and we'll talk about really. Why he was up there off of the woods. Sean was also out on Wyndham high peak and also did a bushwhack that ended up in the wrong place, but that didn't ruin the day.

[00:38:54] And he didn't specify where he was doing that bushwhack. And I was trying to figure out from the drainage pictures where he was, but I'll reach out to him, uh, to ask, but he was celebrating with the crew. And same thing with Scott cats go mountain bruise with the crew to a mind them high peaks for some certain person's finish on something. And then also went up and did new to New Hampshire and started doing his 48 and he knocked off field.

[00:39:21] Well, Tom Wambach, and then did North twin South twin Gale head and Garfield. And then today, which is Tuesday, Ted Osceola and East Osceola. Hmm. Yeah. Hmm. Kudos to him, man. You guys getting out there bagging some peaks. He's going to be a one 15 or sooner, sooner than we know it. It's crazy. Um, yeah, definitely.

[00:39:43] Nicholas golden money cat was somewhere where there are wicked trees and then knocked off trimper and balsam lake on his 2026 fire tower challenge. Uh, Cammy, AKA cam cam five finished a busy three days on a Panther and giants ledges. Uh, Chrissy G started her downstate 28, uh, by doing storm King butter Hill and stake snake hill.

[00:40:09] So cool that people are doing, uh, the downstate New York downstate 28. Really cool. Mike at red hand adventure guys went up giant ledge on a beautiful day. Um, and the two tags that just came out last second, seriously, like no longer than 45 minutes ago, Vicki F hiker goddess adventurers looked like she was repelling out a waterfall somewhere. Very cool. And then Sean scion 72 was somewhere up in the Adirondacks.

[00:40:37] So, uh, he wasn't moaning a lawn. So that's cool. But last but not least, want to give a big comment. Big shout out to Joanne beyond blazes was up at giant ledge. That's it. That's it. We're done with the thing. Oh, is that what I'm just kidding. Okay. I'm just kidding. Joanne finished her four 20 grid and her all trails challenge from the same day. She's the first person to do so, um, up on Wyndham high peak.

[00:41:07] So amazing. So, well, well, someone on. Yeah, I'm going to approach that. We're going to protest that. Okay. On the same day. Yeah. But we say that if you don't tag us, the hype doesn't count. Oh, okay. That's now that's a, that's kind of a technicality on the one hand, but the rules. Am I right, Alex? The rules are the rules.

[00:41:33] And Joanne did not tag us 420 times. Okay. Man. I think she's. So, yeah. So we're our lawyers. Do we hike more and how from Brown station, New York are going to write a letter of protest to the regulating authorities because she didn't tag us enough. Okay. So I'm just putting that out there. Sorry.

[00:42:02] I have to throw down. What do they call it in soccer? Now I watched a couple of soccer games, like a red card or something like that. Fred God. Yeah. You know that I'm, I'm throwing down a red card, whatever it is. I'm protesting moving along. Yeah. Well, congratulations, Joanne. Once again, super cool. There was a whole bunch of people that were out there that knew us either Joanne from social media or knew the podcast and knew through Joanne through the podcast. And that's what it's all about.

[00:42:31] That's everybody coming together, everybody teaming up and being united as one in the Catskills. Well, the one thing that was impressive about her, her post was she mentioned how she started her Catskill journey, not knowing any Catskill hikers. It was just really her and Danny, mighty mischievous. Yeah. And so here it is along the way, she picked up all these, you know, hiker buddies who, you know, would meet up with her from time to time.

[00:43:01] And she's got, we can't call it, what do they call it? A trail family. We can't call it necessarily that because it's not a through hike. But yeah, pretty good group. A lot of high quality people there. So kudos to her, the people she hiked with. And I'm still protesting because she didn't show for. And the other people who didn't, who were there and didn't tag the show. I'm kind of disappointed. So luckily I know the people from the picture. So Danny, mildly mischievous.

[00:43:29] I'm talking about you, buddy. No, he's not so mischievous anymore. That's correct. All right. So let's move on to previous hikes. Tad, what have you been up to buddy? What did you do? Like a 35 mile bushwhack in the Catskills. Let's hear about it. Yeah. So I've, I've been banging out some mileage at the town, local town park, generally between two and three miles almost every morning.

[00:43:55] And I would say over the course of that two to three miles, I do see more wildlife than when I hike in the Catskills, albeit I haven't seen a bear yet. I'm sure that's going to be in the near future. This morning I saw a cat that was so large when I first saw this cat, I thought it was, I thought it was like a deer, you know, cause it was one of these red cats, the same size. So it was relatively big, but the, the highlight of these morning walks, I can't really call

[00:44:21] them hikes is while they're generally between two to three miles, I think the total vertical game is 75 feet. Yeah. Yeah. Pat, you're getting out though. Like, and what's like with the arm, does it have to be in a sling? Like, can you move it kind of like for- Well, so I, I had my post-surgery follow up last Friday and the surgeon, you know, the

[00:44:46] most important thing that I had to ask him was when you were inside, what did you see that resulted in this injury? Was it the function of like a long standing series of degenerative and micro tears and yada, yada, yada, which would necessarily mean that my left shoulder is a ticking bomb that could blow out whenever, or, you know, was my shoulder generally in good health? And this just some freak thing that happened.

[00:45:16] That's almost unexplainable. And he said the latter, he said, your, your shoulder, all the tissue and all that stuff is really healthy. And I'd be surprised if you have this happen to your left shoulder. So that was good news. And then he told, then they told me I could start weaning myself off of that torture device. I think they call it the shoulder abduction sling, but its origin is like in the 1200s when, you know, the feudal lords used to torture the tenant farmers.

[00:45:45] So he told me I could start weaning myself off of that over the course of two weeks. And I think it took me less than 24 hours to put it in the burn pile. That's where it's sitting right now. Nice. Like celebrating 250 years of America with this baby. Yeah. So, you know what? I'm making little baby steps inching along.

[00:46:09] My next follow-up visit is August 20th and between now and then it's like super passive range of motion activities is all I'm permitted to do. But, you know, look, I'll take it. The pain's going down. I can sleep more through the night and getting rid of that abduction sling. Those are all big wins for me. Hell yeah. Like the positive, love the positive. You'll be back out there and you're going to fucking like your first, your first thing. Yeah.

[00:46:38] Let's see. Let me hike up slide from Woodland Valley. That'll be an easy task. Yeah. Well, I don't know if I'm going to be that ambitious, but the one thing is, you know, some of those people have reached out to me before I went public with this and asked what went down. I can not with the phone, hold it up to take a photo. Okay. Unless, you know, I do it with one hand and then generally it's not a decent photo, but

[00:47:06] you know, that's how limited this has been. So, but I'm, I'm literally inching along and who knows, who knows when I'll do more than just hikes in the local town park, but you know, uh, I'll take it for now. Yeah. Awesome. Awesome. Alex, how about you? What have you been up to? Uh, where are you? We, we, we, this is like, he's like said like a sentence so far. Yeah. So after hearing what I just had to say about these epic long town park hikes with these

[00:47:36] unusually large cats and other animals, he probably is so intimidated. Talk about his most. But go ahead, Alex. We're not going to be judgmental. Yeah. I haven't done too much lately. I've just been trying to, uh, kind of taking it easy. Like, but a few weeks ago I tried to do an Everest like in a day. So I went up and down Mount Wachusett in Massachusetts 37 times. Whoa. But I, I didn't make it.

[00:48:02] I got 21,000 feet of vert total and like 24 hours, but I had some like stomach issues and I slept for a few hours. So it was only like 17 hours of moving time. Only. Yeah. That's not impressive. Ted, that was supposed to be a silent moment of basically analyzing what he just said. Yeah. And what the fuck? 21,000 feet of gain. So 17 hours. Yes. 37 times. So you went up at 21 times.

[00:48:32] Uh, no, I went up 37. It's like 550 feet up five 50 down. Wow. 37 times. Wow. I mean, thank God you're not. Hey, well, you should come over to the, the cat skills and start making the herd paths up here. Cause you would be great at doing the herd paths. Why didn't you just do that for your training for a pocket? So you didn't have to find like new navigation. It's too far away out here in Boston. Oh yeah. Yeah.

[00:49:01] Are you, are you listening to like music when you do this podcast books? No, you're just nothing's in your ears. You're just. Impressive. Just swimming. Footsteps. Wow. Except for the last hour, put on Ray chance, the machine. I need to. Hell yeah. Yeah. I gotta admit like that's, that's, that's impressive. I mean, I love, you know, four to 10 hours of hiking of style of silence, you know, just

[00:49:27] hearing nothing but the, the wind and stuff, but that much 17 hours without like any motivation of that's insane. Yeah. Well, I didn't say it in that motivation. So Alex, are you wearing some type of heart rate monitor when you do this? What's your heart rate going uphill? I try to keep it zone two. So I was like, usually like one 50 to like one 40, like going uphill and then going down is like low 100s usually.

[00:49:56] So, and how old are you? I'm 26. Okay. So that's, that's a, that's a good zone for you to just, you know, maintain. For long intervals. I got it. Yeah. So 500 feet of gain. How much, how many miles is that? Like what, what's the distance? I think it was, I think I did 36 miles. Well, up to the 500, like the peak and back down. Um, it is 0.4 each way. Whoa. That's a, it's really steep.

[00:50:23] It's like rock steps the entire way that you have to, it's not, it's honestly going down as hard because it's not a natural step. So it's just like a little too far. Yeah. It's like an elongated step here and there and stuff. These are manmade rock steps. Yeah. Okay. 0.4 miles, 500 feet is pretty significant gain. Yeah. That's why I picked it more efficient. That's like, that was your path material. Are you feeling like a lactic buildup when you do this?

[00:50:51] No, no, this is mostly muscular fatigue after like, I'd say 12 hours. So you can kind of feel it. Like you can't get your heart rate up as much, but you can just keep going. It's not as fast. And what are you using to like fuel yourself or hydrate anything special? I usually just do liquid nutrition. I drink a gallon. Yeah. I drink a gallon and a half of mountain dew, which is disgusting. That's not liquid nutrition. That's just calories and caffeine.

[00:51:20] But this sounds like fraternity hazing. I felt like it. God. Thank you, sir. Can I have another please? Yeah. Okay. At the top, he jugs a gallon of milk and then runs down, pukes it all out. Yeah. So if you ever consider for like an effort like that, those long hours, like ingesting protein. Um, yeah. Like some of my, my new liquid nutrition has like two grams of protein, like per hour, which is not a lot.

[00:51:46] It's mostly for like, like satiety, but not too much protein. It's just extra weight. Yeah. Well, you can't, you could, you could have like a table, your own like food station down at the bottom and just grab. There's my car. Damn. All right. Yeah. So Stash, how are you going to top that? Well, then, uh, you know, I, I went up and down Hawk at 37 times today. So the, I heard path now.

[00:52:16] Um, so I did, I did Hawk it today, uh, with Chris, uh, Gerbian. Um, and with Misty, his dog, Misty. Um, I haven't been to Hawk it in a long time. I've really, once again, was, was interested in kind of seeing the herd path and seeing how it was. And I gotta admit, this is a well-established herd path. Of course, you know, once again, the, if the nettles grew in and you can't see it, but you can always see it.

[00:52:45] And towards the top, you know, once it's like, it is dirty, but it's all switchbacky. It's, it's, it's actually not that bad. Like I didn't find it bad at all. You know, a lot of people pushed the rocks to the side and it looks almost like they actually made a switchback going back up to the top. Yeah. So what we, what we really, really, really want to hear. You kind of mentioned how are the nettles this time of year? Oh God, I wore shorts.

[00:53:15] Really? Yeah. I will. I'm born to nettles. Yeah. But was the trail that well established, the nettles pushed that far out that it was an issue? They were, I should have sent you a picture. Um, uh, but they, they were well established over, you know, touching and everything like that. I'm just, I'm prone to it now. I, it doesn't bother me. I'll just ignore it. And I'm more, you know, just in tune with, with nature and stuff like that, that I'm just like, ah, whatever, fucking nettles.

[00:53:44] It's not going to bother me. And if they do, I'd rather have nettles and ticks. So, um, but you know, once again, like the whole way up, you know, it's, it's, it's steep game as you begin and you just go all the way up to the top and it's nice. Got to the summit signed in, got a, had a little bit of lunch, talked with Chris about, you know, the podcast and he wonder how I started it and you know, how you jumped in on, you know, and, and stuff.

[00:54:10] And it was just like, I do this because I love preaching and teaching about the Catskills and you know, look, look at where we are now. Like he, he made me think of like, wow, you know, look at where we are now. And he's, he's always asking those big salaries. You have that, like, you got that new vehicle that fully decked out, uh, overland vehicle with the podcast logos on it, you know? Yeah. And we got freaking, we got, we're professional. We have stickers. We have freaking pens now. Pens.

[00:54:40] Like talk about going on to the next level stickers. Yeah. And the next level is when Hudson, uh, Hudson cider names a beverage after you. Right. After, after the podcast. I don't want to take off. When you get a photo, when you get your photo on a can of cider and then you can walk it. That's how it has to be at your photo on a can of cider. And that way you can walk into tops and tannersville or anywhere else. And when they try to stop you walking out the door, cause you didn't pay for those ciders,

[00:55:09] you can point to the photo and say, Hey, these are mine. I want to just open it up right in front of them. Be like, look at the picture and then show you like you do with the microphone. Right. Yeah. Right in the face. Yeah. There you go. It was a number. We started off. Uh, Chris wanted to start off at seven o'clock and I'm like, ha, you know, it's my day off, buddy. I'd like to, cause of the heat. Yes, it was. I mean, the projected like heat index was supposed to be in the nineties, like early or late,

[00:55:38] like high eighties on the summits. So I understand. Definitely. We got up there and it was actually windy. So it was nice. We actually cooled off. But once you get into that bowl of, of hawket going down, I think no wind at all, just absolute sweaty, disgusting. It was horrible. Um, uh, and then, you know, we cooled off. Uh, we, we like, you know, checked out the falls. Uh, Misty had a great time. Misty was amazing. And Chris was amazing. He was a great time.

[00:56:08] Oh yeah. First time you guys hook up to hike. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. And he supports the show. He's, he's, he's a local supporter. Once again, just amazing that, you know, once again, this community is coming together and, and doing this. And then I'm like, shit, it's only 12 o'clock. Like I could hit so many stops on my way back. So did you, I did. I stopped at, uh, Hunter's field falls, which is only like a two mile hike where you get to go see some waterfalls and you can see some fossilized rocks and stuff.

[00:56:38] If you look carefully. Didn't you do that with your wife? I did. And it was beautiful. Yeah. The waterfalls were flowing like hardcore. We had a rain storm and stuff. They were dry this time and it says no swimming. Unfortunately, I wanted to go swim so bad. And, and I didn't really sign because some sign said no swimming. Yes. And then across the way is a house that has fricking like cameras and stuff like that.

[00:57:07] And yeah. So, I mean, haven't you heard the saying, if a tree falls in the woods, does it make a sound? I mean, if, if a hiker goes swimming in a stream and there's no other hikers or people there to see them swim in the stream. True. Did they really go swimming in the stream? If Stosh does a cannon ball in off a 12 foot ledge, does it really make a sound? Correct. But there you go.

[00:57:32] And then after that, there's a place over off of the long path called Manor Kill falls. Hmm. Really cool, like cascading waterfalls of like, I think it's like 300 feet cascading waterfalls, but there is no way to get from the top of the falls to the bottom falls. Like I have to go back and figure it out when I have more time because it looks like every

[00:58:00] side is just swiped with, with like nothing but vertical edges. So maybe from the base, but I need a DEP permit to get down there because that's scary reservoir. I mean, I mean, I tend, but yeah, I don't really don't. But what? Um, but, and then at the top of the Manor Kill falls though, are these strapped in like, it looks like

[00:58:25] metal pillars that are probably about two feet high that I wonder if it used to be because right across the street used to be an old motel. So I wonder if this was like a tourist attraction of where they had like ropes or ladders or stuff and people would like rappel down into these falls and be able to swim. There's like, you know, those things that they call potholes, Ted, of course you do with, uh, with Danny Davis, the geomorphology and stuff where they would just spin around. You could have these there's potholes all over the place where you can jump in.

[00:58:55] It's like your own hot tub. Wow. That's cool. Yeah. So like, I'm looking at this and I'm like, there's no easy way to get down to it. So I was like, okay, I'll come back once again. I don't have that much time. I want to go. And then I stopped at Mount Yusiantha and I was excited. Cause I haven't been up there in a while. The last time I was up there, I remember going up with the Tesla and I bottomed out like five or six times. And I'm just like scraping the bottom, like, Oh shit, that's horrible.

[00:59:23] But this time, because it's on the fire tower challenge, it's all beautifully. Well, graveled. You can fly. Wow. Yeah. So, um, got up to the top there at the summit, which is usually a lot colder than the base. It was 87 degrees with wind. Like it was hot and got to take amazing pictures. See a beautiful view. The, uh, smoke haze wasn't up yet. And it was just phenomenal. So I got home by three o'clock.

[00:59:52] I was, I was, I was well happy. So like getting out early as it's, as it's good things. But once again, I'm tired. I got to wake up at four o'clock tomorrow morning. It's going to suck. But anyway, but anyway, it was a good time. I got to see the herd path off on Hockett that, you know, the DEC is not going to do anything for another 25 years. So nobody cares. Uh, and, uh, you know, we get to hear about Alex's journey up pocket. So I'm very curious of that.

[01:00:22] Oh yeah. Journey up. So you went up the west Northwestern way, correct? From bear pen of lie. Yeah. I went up from a Turk hollow road. I bushwhacked four or five hours at night from Turk hollow road over to a Hockett. Okay. Nobody takes that way, but tad. Yeah. Yeah. So coming in that direction. That's a lot of fun. Yeah. It all depends what time of year you come up through there. Did you get those?

[01:00:52] It gets thick and I'm not just talking about nettles. Everything. Well, it's my legs were cut up by the end of it. Yeah. Yeah. Did you get to see the, uh, the washing machines and the, uh, the dishwasher? I mean, you were at night, so you didn't get to see that. No, I didn't see that, but I saw like must be hundreds of like reflective pieces of rope that were really like disorienting me, like going like in a straight line, like in multiple directions. It was really weird. Interesting.

[01:01:21] Well, we'll talk about hallucinations. They were there. Nice. Nice. Stay tuned. Yeah. Stay tuned for hallucinations on Hockett. Yeah. Yeah. This is why, this is why Alex doesn't drink alcohol. He gets his buzz by doing other things. Awesome. Awesome. So once again, uh, volunteer. 3500 club Catskill trail crew, Catskill mountains called visitor center, Jolly rovers, trail crew, Bramley mountain fire tower, wherever you can volunteer.

[01:01:50] It does make a difference. Also, if you need stickers, let me know or go to camp Catskill to get free stickers. So let's break it into the inaccurate weather forecast. Here is your weekend's weather forecast. This weekend looks to be a great weekend for hiking. But remember, one thing that you should be aware of is that the wildfire smoke is still flowing in from Canada.

[01:02:20] While conditions are improving throughout the weekend, hazy skies and reduced visibility is still possible, especially on Friday. Just remember, if you have respiratory sensitivities, you should pay close attention to the air quality conditions before heading into high peaks. On Friday, July 17th, expect mostly sunny skies with some haze continuing to linger from the wildfires in Canada. Conditions should be warm but comfortable for mid-July with lighter winds, generally good hiking weather as well.

[01:02:50] Summit temperatures will rain from 72 to 77 degrees. And the humidity will be a little bit higher, so you will be sweating. On Saturday, July 18th, clouds will increase as humidity returns to the mountains. A few showers and an afternoon thunderstorm are possible, so hikers should keep an eye on the changing conditions. Summit temperature will range from 70 to 75 degrees with the humidity bringing it up to the mid-80s.

[01:03:18] On Sunday, July 19th, cooler and less humid conditions move back into the Catskill area. Expect a mix of sun and clouds with a chance of an isolated afternoon thunderstorm, like usual in the summer. But overall, be much more comfortable today in the high peaks. Summit temperatures will range from 65 to 70 degrees with the humidity pushing it near 80. So, it looks to be a great weekend to get out.

[01:03:42] Just remember to be safe, be prepared, and don't become tomorrow's rescue story. Back to you guys. That inaccurate weather forecast. Thank you once again, Stosh, for doing that. And don't forget to mention the smoke from all the fires up in Canada. Yeah, right? Yeah, let's see what that's going to do. They're smoking that bacon up there, so... Smoking the bacon or smoking the reefer up there. Well, it was...

[01:04:12] Bacon, I think. I don't think Canadians are that cool. Maybe they are. I don't know. Yeah, that's true, actually. I think they legalized it before we did. We are cooler than the Americans. We did. All right, so let's break it on to the last set of amazing sponsors. So, is it time for some new gear for hiking in the Catskills? You need to say no more. Camp Catskill in Tannersville has all your hiking needs.

[01:04:38] Footwear, socks, moisture wicking shirts, freeze dried meals, Catskill merchandise, and more. They have all the essentials for your hiking needs. Located in Tannersville and online, check out Camp Catskill. If you want free stickers, stop there. Also, you need to check out another Summit, a non-profit program that leads outdoor adventure activities for veterans and first responders for free. Outdoor adventures like walking, hiking, paddling, and even backpacking.

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[01:05:30] So, as we already know, Alex Raimo joins us tonight to talk about his Catskill Diartissima attempt. So, if you don't know what the Diartissima is, an extreme endurance hiking route where hikers summit all of the designated high peaks in any area, and this is specifically the New York Catskill Mountains, one push, one through hike basically of all the 35 peaks.

[01:05:58] So, Alex is here to talk about that tonight and his attempt to do this whole diartissima. Were you attempting to break the record? Oh, yeah. This is my second shot at trying to do the 35. That's news to me. You didn't tell me. Yeah. Well, we have a revelation right out of the box. Right out of the box. That was the second time. Well, I have to say, Matt Mata, he broke the record on like the 33. So, like without like self double top or round top or whatever makes it 35.

[01:06:29] He did it in three and a half days, like two weeks before I did my attempt. So, I just had to put that out there. Who did that? Matthew Mata. Oh. You should have him on. He's a beast. Definitely. Wow. I didn't know this. Like, what the fuck? The social media doesn't post this stuff. What the hell? What does he post this on? How did you find this out? Um, Strava. Strava. I got friends with him on Strava. Yeah. Of course, of course.

[01:06:56] So, now Alex, as I know, you know, you contacted me. I followed you throughout this hike. Unfortunately, you didn't get to finish this because of like the circumstances that you made an awesome decision to get out of there or, you know, not, but, you know, can't wait to hear it about it tonight on the show. I've been waiting for this, you know, I'm glad you made it on the show.

[01:07:22] But, uh, what we need is a little bit of a background from yourself. Let's not talk about doing this one 500 foot peak 37 times. Okay. Go back in time 26 years ago to when you were born as a little baby. What'd you start running up? Oh, gosh. Um, I, I didn't like cross country in high school for a little bit when I was a cyclist also like in high school. So I think that's where I get some like endurance base.

[01:07:51] And then after college, I did like, um, about 1700 miles of the PCT. Yeah. That's kind of where I got like the, the through hiking bug. Um, that was fun. And then like took a break for a year or so and then kind of get back into just long distance hiking last year. Then I had to get like a leg surgery for compartment syndrome, uh, which is the second time I got it. So I took like a break for a few months and then just trying to get back into the swing of things with, uh, like this hike.

[01:08:19] This is like the caskill 35 is something I've had my, like, uh, my site set on for a while. So can't wait to go back at it. Uh, again, next year too. So 1700 miles on the PCT PCT 2,100 miles, right? So it's like 2,650. Oh, okay. So you got 900 miles left. Why did you only do 1700 miles? Well, I started pretty late in the desert. I started like on June 11th.

[01:08:46] So it was pretty hot and like, I didn't train at all. Like it shouldn't have, like the fact I got that far as a miracle, I should not have. I was, I injured my both knees, both ankles, like within like a month. Um, it wasn't good, but ultimately like I pulled the plug. It's because I ran out of time. It's just not feasible. Nice. I mean, he at least pulled the plug. Once again, this is a year, you're once again, putting your, your, your life first, instead of, you know, other people to rescue on the PCD. Nonetheless, it's not, it's not an easy trail.

[01:09:17] I mean, compared to the East, it's easy. Oh, that's a triggered. I don't know. Like I had a close call on the PCT. I was at on a pass in the Sierra, like 12,000 feet. And I like spend a, spend a night like without any like shelter. Well, I grabbed myself with my tent just to stay warm. I had like a sort of an incident, but that's kind of why I ended it too. So no, you before, you know, Tad, uh, you, you've done endurance biking.

[01:09:44] Like how, how does that play into like, like, like hiking and stuff like that? Um, well, I think they go hand in hand, but we're just not going to skip over the, I wrapped myself in a tent and I had an incident and that played into, um, you know, uh, terminating my, my, uh, effort out there. So tell us about the incident, Alex. I mean, yeah. Um, so I was on shepherd pass in the, uh, Sierra, which is one of the more difficult, um, mountain passes that you can use to connect to the PCT.

[01:10:15] And I was trying to beat, um, the sunlight or to be sunset. And I was, there's a big snow field separating me from like the bottom of, uh, the snow field to the top of the pass. So a few hundred feet, it's like a 45, 50 degree slope. And it just recently snowed and I was following up someone else's like boot tracks. And then I got to the edge of the snow field, like following them. And then they just disappeared. I was like, Oh, I think that I should not have followed these.

[01:10:41] And, but my pack weight was so heavy that I kind of lost my footing. And I just like straddled the snow field because I was being pulled down it. Um, and like two weeks before I was there, someone broke their legs in like the same spot. So I was kind of nervous. And then I thought I could keep going up to connect to the top of the pass a different way that was safer, but ultimately I couldn't.

[01:11:05] And I ended up spending about 12 hours at the near the top of the pass, like in the snow wrapped in my tent and sleeping bag. And I got frostbite on my, my fingers kind of minor, but they were numb for three months. Wow. And how many, how, how long was that? It was in the PCT where you experienced that. That was about, uh, no, that was the last day of the PCT. Oh, okay. So that's when you call the quits. Yeah. I thought that was a good, a good, uh, time to bail. Okay. Okay.

[01:11:33] I was going to say like, this is like, you know, like three months in and you're just like, yeah, I can continue on. No, that was after Mount windy. Yeah. So how long is that snow field that you were talking about? Mm. Just to put it in perspective a few miles. No, it's only like five or 600 feet. Okay. But it's extremely steep. Yeah. Like a lot of deer, like when they were migrating, like once like 50 deer, like died on it, like it's falling down. So it's like, it's steep and there are rocks at the bottom. So yeah.

[01:12:03] And you're trying to go up slope without a snowshoes on. Uh, I had crampons. No, excuse me. I had a micro spikes, which is not enough and dragging poles. So it's enough to get you into a dangerous spot. Yeah. And, and then you just keep going. You don't turn around when you, yeah, you just keep going. Okay. Okay. And like, in my mind, I was like, I could traverse this to get to the, where that the path should be. But if I fall, like it's not going to end well. So I didn't do that. Gotcha.

[01:12:31] So going to your, your cycling, uh, road or mountain bike road. Okay. And you were, were you a racer? Yeah. I raced a juniors for like a couple of years. Like, am I really like doing time trials? Gotcha. So like a five or 10 mile route. This goes fastest wins. Yeah. So were you like a cat two cat three cat four? Okay. Gotcha. Yeah. Explain that to a human being that doesn't know about this stuff.

[01:13:00] So, uh, the cycling has like this tiered or ranking system that when you, you start bike racing, you start off at the citizen level and then you progress to the next category, which is cat four. Then you move. If you're good, you move on good enough to move on. You move to cat three, then to cat two, then to cat one. And part of cat one is pro riding.

[01:13:25] And yeah, out of like every 10,000 cyclists, probably 10, 10,000 racing cyclists, probably 10 or cat one. Wow. Out of, out of, out of 10, uh, cat one. And I'm not sure what the exact numbers are these days, but out of 10 cat one cyclists, like 0.0005 are pro.

[01:13:52] That's how stratified the road cycling community is. So, um, with that, like, those are the crazy people that you see, like doing insane pedaling with their like hands talked on the curved things, uh, the, the curves and the handlebars and stuff like that. Right. Yeah. And an, and an arrow position, that's what the time trialing is. And then you, but you also have a criterium racing, which is on a closed course going around and around and around.

[01:14:21] And then you have your traditional road racing where you're out on the road riding, whether it's 35 miles or 120 miles. So there's different within cycling bicycle racing. There's different types of events, um, with different types of efforts. But if you're a time trial list, um, you're good at, uh, sustained effort dealing with a lot of lactic, uh, pain in your muscles and being able to maintain, you know, a relatively

[01:14:50] hard, high heart rate for a long period of time. That's basically what time trial is. So time trial was genuinely know how to suffer. That's what they do. Okay. Okay. So speaking of like knowing how to suffer, you know, Alex, are you, uh, like a 35 or like, what are you like your mountain climbing experience? You're not a third. So with this, this coming attempts of doing the diartissima, like this was your, your first attempt at, at, at the 35 peaks.

[01:15:21] Um, yeah, I had only done 13 of the peaks before. Uh, this, this effort. So most of them are new. Wow. Which wasn't ideal, but it was a good way to recon the course for like future efforts. This is more efficient, I guess. So like the, I mean, true. It's, it's kind of more of down to earth instead of, you know, doing these like, like, you know, eight, four, 20 grids and then attempting it.

[01:15:45] So now are you familiar with much besides like hiking in Massachusetts in the Northeast? Like. Absolutely. Not too much. Like Massachusetts, New York. Like I grew up in Northern New Jersey. So I went to Harriman a lot with my parents and my family. But other than that, like I was an Eagle scout. I sport some places in like New York, but nothing too crazy. Wow. So you do the PCT. Yeah.

[01:16:12] Unfortunately, you don't, you do 1700 miles, which is still fucking a lot. I mean, unfortunately I'm not saying that's a bad thing. Jesus Christ. But now you're like, let's do the freaking diartissima. Like how the, sorry to say it like this. How the fuck do you go after that? I'm like, like. I honestly, Mike Sudi, Mike Sudi's effort when he, like, I think 2018 where he did in like, like two and a half days, two days, six hours, something like that. That really inspired me.

[01:16:40] Like where he broke, uh, uh, Ted Kaiser's record. Um, yeah, I think just seeing like his, uh, the mountain peak fitness video on YouTube is watching that over and over again. Uh, that was really, that inspired me. And I also thought I could do it because it's, I think it's kind of a good warmup for the Adirondack 46 FKT, which I might eye on that. Like eventually maybe, but I had to do this one first and this is, I've can't stop thinking about it. So, yeah.

[01:17:10] And just for a reminder for our listeners, Mike Sudi is now the canister maintainer. Uh, Mike Sudi is, you know, let's just call him iron Mike. He's pretty hardcore. I mean, he's really hardcore. So yeah, quite a test, quite a testament to him doing, doing the 3,500 and under three days. So insane total bad-ass. If you, he hangs out at a West kill brewery or at, um, Woodstock brewery. Yeah.

[01:17:39] So if you see him inside, you gotta buy him a beer, give him a high five. Yeah. So now that's, that's insane. Like just out of the bat of nowhere. Yeah. And he's a cool dude. If you pump into him on the trail, he's a really cool and humble guy. All right. Back to Alex. Yeah. Um, so like, how did you like research this? Like, like how did you plan this? This is, this is not like this, something that is plastered like the PCT on the internet and such.

[01:18:08] Like it's, it's gotta take work. Yeah. So a lot of it revolved around like Mike Suti's route. Um, I have like a whole Cal Topo map that I've been editing for the past like couple of years and just like kind of trying to optimize it and just trying to just staring at it, trying to think of a way to connect the piece that makes sense and avoids private property. But it's really hard to do. Um, I just kind of edited some of Mike's routes. Um, he's, he used like what, like Graham and Double Top. Like those are closed.

[01:18:37] And I added South Double Top and Round Top to kind of complete the 35. Nice. And yeah. So like, I was also Mike's recommendation. I like sent my map to him and he like gave some advice. And also like I talked with Matt Mata about it as well. And he gave me some tips too, but mostly just staring at Cal Topo, trying to figure out a good way to get a, to get, uh, to all the peaks. And it didn't turn out great this time on Hocket, but other than that, it was pretty good. Nice.

[01:19:06] So what did you do any training to build up for this where you just generally fit all the time and you didn't break your training routine? This was my 10th. So I got, I had a leg surgery on both my calves in October. So this is my 10th hike. Because of the compartment syndrome. Yeah. What is that by the way? I hate to interrupt, but what is compartment syndrome? Essentially the fascia that holds like that surrounds my muscles doesn't expand enough when I exercise.

[01:19:33] And I like lose feeling in my legs and the ability to like lift my feet. They just go limp. Wow. That's a little extreme. Yeah. Sounds pretty dangerous when you're out trail running or trail hiking. Yeah. Yeah. Being able to lift your feet. I am. Could result in injury to your rotator cuff. Okay. I said what happened to you? Uh, yeah, could be. Mm-hmm. Well, I dislocated my shoulder on the first attempt. So. Oh. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:20:01] I can understand how that happens now. Okay. So you did this unsupported, right? Do we under? Okay. So what we, we had, um, this fellow Chris, uh, AKA chicken fat on the show about a year or so ago did the, what was it? The long path unsupported and his idea of unsupported means that you can't even go into a storage shop and buy a slice of greasy pizza.

[01:20:31] Right? So for you, what is unsupported mean when you do this? Just no external support of any means and not picking up anything along the way or dropping off your gear. Oh, wow. So everything you start with you end with. And, and so what is it then that you start with? What do you load the pack with to make it? Well, how many miles were you're projecting this to be? Um, I think 141 and I did 133.

[01:21:01] My, I think my route was five or 10 miles. Um, shorter than planned, which is not, I wasn't happy. So you made a, you made it 133 out of 141. I think it would have been like 150. So I was going to say once you said you ended on Indian head, right? Yeah. So yeah. Oh, okay. So here you are. What is it in your backpack when you start out for like this three plus or minus day excursion? What's in there? How much does it weigh?

[01:21:31] How many liters is it? What's going on in the backpack? Yeah. I had a 28 liter best like style pack. Um, total weight was a hundred ounces. Uh, it's like a little over six pounds, seven, seven pounds. And that's including my phone, which is 10 ounces. Um, so just making clear. Um, so I had a 50 degree synthetic quilt. That was good. I had a six panel of a Nemo switchback, like foam sleeping pad.

[01:21:59] Um, and an emergency blanket that I put over the quilt as that's my main shelter. It's not, I kind of relied on the lean twos and my other, like my rain jacket for more shelter. And that was mostly it. And just a lot of, uh, batteries, like a waist lamp and a headlamp. And those batteries weigh a lot though. Yeah. I had about, I think almost a pound of batteries. Yeah.

[01:22:25] I was going to say like my, my batteries that I carry are very overweight, but I like to be 100% charged every night, especially with my, you know, my headlamp and my phone. No, totally. Yeah. I'm with you on that. And are you using anything to recharge? You have like a solar panel with you, or is that just a waste and you're not using something like that? No, no solar panel, but I did have like a one 10,000 milliamp hour, like a battery bank

[01:22:53] and then like a smaller $3,000, 3,000 milliamp hour one from a December watch. Okay. It's mostly like batteries like this for my, uh, for my headlamp. Jesus. Double a batteries. This is a 3400 milliamp hour battery. Yeah. But it, and it's, it's a rechargeable and it's a little bit bigger than a double a. Yeah. It weighs like a one and a half ounces roughly. Wow.

[01:23:22] So how, what did you do for food? What was your planning for food? Was it just fluids the whole way? Was that your plan? Almost entirely fluids. It was like 16,000 calories of fluids, like a liquid nutrition. Um, I use mostly like Morden and it's called infinite nutrition. I got sick of the infinite just because I got like a throat infection on day one and it's kind of got worse and worse. And I think that didn't help, but what time of year did you stay? How did you start?

[01:23:53] It was Memorial day weekend. Yeah. Of this, of this year. Yeah. Okay. So you, you have your a hundred ounce 16 or 26 liter pack. Mm. Mm. And what do you have like powders to mix with water? Is that what the nutrition is? Yeah. Then I had like two like soft flasks and then like two liters of, uh, like two, two, one liter bottles also.

[01:24:19] So it's like a total capacity was like four liters for water. And what's the weight of your, your food. And what's the weight of your, your food when you start the, the powder. Oh gosh. I think it was 30. It was pretty heavy. Um, heavy the weight here. You enjoy this. Yeah. Yeah. No. Oh, come on. You're going to go out. You're going to, it's a suffer fest and the food is not even food. Like, like my, my pack today going to pocket, which is like not even two, four miles, but

[01:24:47] it's gotta be over like 20 something pounds. I think it might, I started at 21 pounds. Yeah. I'm, I'm, I have a Arizona iced tea, a power eight, a fricking two things, a Doritos. My, my God. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just going to live off of fricking water for the next three days. Well, like each serving 300 calories. So it's pretty, pretty hefty water. Yeah.

[01:25:12] And so did you like work out the math and do calculations to know how many calories to bring along? Yeah, I tried. And, and how did that work out? Were you like on budget over budget under budget in terms of the food supply? I was pretty spot on. Um, yeah, yeah, I was fine. Okay. So now did you have like something with your, like, you know, your smartwatch or your phone to like, like tell you like, Hey, you need to drink 300 calories right now.

[01:25:41] Like, was that something that you had planned or was that like, you know, you kind of guessed. I tried to do one an hour. Yeah. It's pretty, pretty solid. So like, but the only thing is if I don't find water, I don't drink or I'm not eating. So it's bonk. Like going up for, I got extremely dehydrated and I had to like detour to the life. I can't scan it. Scan Dakin. I can't pronounce it. Scan Dakin, Brooke lean to. Oh, the Shan Dakin. Shan Dakin. Thank you.

[01:26:11] Uh, Brooke lean to. I spent like, I think 12 hours there. Oh, wow. To revive myself. Cause I didn't go pee for like half a day. Oh, that's, that's a little extreme. Ouch. Yeah. Ooh. So that kind of ruined it. Yeah. That's scary. You know? And now like, you know, once again, I'm thinking you have to, like, I think of only like the extreme runners that have to do these, like on the Boston marathon.

[01:26:36] Once again, they have like something like you must have 300 calories right now to maintain your balance. Like, like, and you're just, you're out there in the goddamn wilderness, not with somebody like, like handing you off a Pepsi or something on the side of the road. It's like, oh shit, I got to find 300 calories somehow. Yeah. Basically. Wow. But it was pretty good. Was water resupplying a big issue then? Only on fur. Other than that, it was like pretty plentiful.

[01:27:05] Yeah. When you say only on first, so how did you, how was it you were approaching for? From Maven hollow. Maven hollow. Maven hollow. Maven hollow. Is that? There's an easement there. Okay. You mean Burnham hollow? I don't know. So what did you slide mountain? And yeah, that's my map up here. No, like it's really not commonly used. I don't know.

[01:27:35] It was pretty, it's a pretty miserable approach on us. Yeah. All right. So let me, yeah, let me, let me look into this because once again, uh, like little, yeah, it's right across from little Peck road. Maven hollow road. Interesting. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know where that is. Okay. Oh, awesome. Wow. So you're in that and that takes you right up to fur. Yeah. There's like an old road that goes up there. An old logging road. Yeah.

[01:28:05] It's extremely steep. Yeah. Oh, I got you. Yeah. And so you were, you were going to go from fur over to big Indian. Mm. And then where were you going to go? That's going to do the equal balsam, then go to a bear pen fly. But instead I went to the lean to for half a day. Okay. Wow. And then when I was walking to it, I was like, if I don't, I really didn't want to

[01:28:34] go there, but I knew it had water. I knew the ridge wouldn't. And I was just imagining myself passed out on the trail and I knew I had to like detour or else like it would be over. So. Is it fair to say that you were like, you knew you were in crisis mode? Yeah. I knew if I didn't drink, I would, it wouldn't be good. And for how long was it? You were in crisis mode then? How long did you know that this was coming? You said you hadn't peed for a day and a half. Like I, I didn't pee until the morning. Okay.

[01:29:03] So I got there like 8 PM. I didn't pee until the fall, the morning. Wow. Eight or nine. Damn. Now, now, yeah, that's, that's a little like crazy. So now have you encountered anybody on the trail during these times? Well, on an off trail. Until then? No, I saw one person. She was on the only log across the, the creek or whatever I had to cross to go up East wildcat to connect to a table.

[01:29:32] So that was the only person I saw. And then honestly, once I got to some of those people are, once I got to the devil's path, other than that, there's no one on the trail, which is kind of nice. And we, I mean, we, we should have kind of go down and gone over to logistics at first. So you're starting, we're going to start all the way from Peeker Moose road and end at Windham route 23. Correct? No, that's like the, what most people have done. I started at, um, with Balsam Lake and then I like Millbrook Ridge or no, like dry book

[01:30:02] Ridge, like trailhead or something like that. So Balsam Lake to South double top and Bushwhack to, um, like the road there, like to the Pine Hill, West branch trail, wherever it's called. Then go over the, the Creek and then Bushwhacked over to East wildcat connected with, um, like the trail that leads up to table, did Peeker Moose and the nine. What the fuck? Yeah. I did. I did after alone, it went, it was dark too.

[01:30:32] When I did like that Bushwhack. Uh, but you're feeling good through this stage. No, no, no. So you, so you, when you, you cross over to East wildcat, um, you you're crossing over the East branch, no, the West branch of the never sink. Then you drop down into Denning. Right. And you're going over to table. So you go over the, the East branch of the never sink right over the bridge. You get water there. Okay.

[01:30:59] Then you're going to head up table, Peeker Moose, double back out to loan. It's nighttime now, but you're not going to encounter any water. You're going out to loan, Rocky Balsam Friday, still no water. And then you, then you, then you step out by on the, the boroughs traverse by Cornell. Right. You get there and then you bang a right. You do Cornell Wyndham and then head back towards slide. Still no water.

[01:31:29] Um, like after Windberg, it was really cold. Um, so I was fine. Like I got four liters at the table spring. So I, I've had, I've run out of water there before I knew what to expect. So that was an issue. And then like, I filled up at the slide spring and I was fine. Okay. That's a good point. Yeah. You're up and over slide. Then you head down to a, what is that? 42 that goes through there. Down, down. Do you take like the easement road out towards giant ledge? Yes. Panther.

[01:32:00] Then you whack down Panther towards little Peck road. Yeah, pretty much. I like, but it's going, but it's now it's going sideways. Now you're coming off of Panther and it's, you haven't peed. No, I, I peed. I peed then. This is like pee talk. Okay. Yeah. We want to know what we want. Did you post all your pee stops or okay. That nevermind. I don't know if that's a safer work. Yeah. So, um, yeah, I whacked off Panther. Like they're like the primitive campsites.

[01:32:29] Once you like descend from like Panther, then go down. And I like pretty much nailed like staying only on public land, which was, which was good, but that was a really tough bushwhack, like surprisingly difficult. Yeah. And yeah, then it went over to fur, but it was really hot when I did the road walk and I lost a lot of water then and going up, I was like, Oh, I really don't want to carry the water. I had like two liters still. And then I got to some water at the top of fur and I was like started filtering.

[01:32:57] And then I realized it was tons of bear poop. It's all in the water. I'm like, Oh, I'm not going to drink this. Like, not for me. I'm not that desperate yet. So. Dude. I was later. It was. So now recapping all of this, I don't know why I didn't come to this, but now I see where little peck hollow is and now you're going to big Indian. That's I mean, once again, you're bushwhacking off a Panther, not the traditional route.

[01:33:23] Like that means everybody would tag Panther come back down and then hit, you know, up in the biscuit bar, not brisket brook, sort of the biscuit brook area. And then whack going up big Indian and fur, but you decided to do a whole different fricking thing. And this, does this like cause kind of like a, a little chaos of be like, are you confident? You feel good.

[01:33:48] You're going up, you know, big Indian for kind of, I mean, they're not the most difficult, but I mean, where you're approaching it from, it is pretty difficult. Not many people. It was really hard. Okay. What made, what made that approach so hard getting up to fur? Um, well I'm already over, I'm over a day in at this point and I did not train at all. Really for this. I probably did about 20 hours total of training since October before this. Are you on track though? Yeah, it's still possible. It's still possible.

[01:34:18] Like the FKT pace I was beating is four days, 13 hours. So that's about 1.38 miles per hour average overall. So that's doable. Like I think most, I think most people could ban that out if they really wanted to, or if they needed to. Um, but going up for us is hard because it's so steep. I was really, my muscles were not strong enough to, to hang with that. I was, my steps were not even moving past the front of the other foot.

[01:34:48] It was really slow. Yeah. And if people, you know, when you're coming up to go to Panther slide mountain area, you look over to your right off of, you know, we're talking about a, what's that? I mean, I got, I went, I went there. Uh, I stayed there the night we had the, uh, the urban cowboy resort. Like, uh, you know, if you look up there for is significantly steep and you don't know it until you do it.

[01:35:15] And not many, I would say very, very few have gone up this area. I mean, so now you're, you're going up there, you're, you're at the shandake and lean to, and you haven't pissed in a while. So like, how are you? Number one, how are you staying like conscious with, with this lack of calories and stuff, lack of water? Like I need a goddamn fricking big, huge, big sandwich to keep myself moving.

[01:35:43] I even on honking, you're running on water fumes. Basically. That's right. Like the other half of my butter fingers that I brought, I brought one king size, butter fingers. Oh my God. Hit the spot. And how are you like when you're, when you're moving, like kind of going downhill uphill? Are you like running, you trotting your, your fast pacing? Like, what do you, what's your moment? Like your movement?

[01:36:08] I'm just trying to walk as fast as possible, which meant like a 25 mile an hour, no 25 minute mile to 20 minute mile pace. Really slow. Like nothing crazy. I was really fatigued by that point. And honestly, sleeping and stopping at that lean to, I think saved the effort. If I didn't do that, I don't think I would have been able to gone, been able to go much further. Honestly, I slept seven or eight hours. You get, you get to the lead to you sleep seven or eight hours, right?

[01:36:37] What do you feel like when you wake up? Yeah. Are you all tight and stiff? Yeah. I was like, surprisingly good. I was kind of woke up in a panic. Like, Oh my gosh, I just ruined the effort. Um, but I felt good that my, I got my sanity back. I only got like an hour of sleep before starting. So I was already pretty tired, but, um, I don't know, kind of got going. I was just concerned it hadn't peed yet. Well, did that. And then it just kept going up.

[01:37:04] I was like, Oh my gosh, it has added like 500, 600 feet of vert to this effort. It's already going to be 41,000 feet, but kept going. I go honestly, the Belair, like the resort was pretty awesome. Just going through there. It was pretty easy. And then going over to like bear pen and fly. It's just trying to stay on pace. Are you trying to make up time on the road when you're doing the road segments? Yeah. Like ideally you would run this whole, the whole road section. It should be, it should be run.

[01:37:30] Um, I'm not fit enough to do that in my pack way too much to do that. But, but on the road section, I had two pit bulls like came at me. I scared the bejesus that I was like, Oh my gosh, they came running from this yard. Yeah. By the way, Mike Sudi's got two pit bulls. Might've been. Oh, that's why I'm just joking. Mike wouldn't do anything like that, but okay. I mean, they're like, you know, at this time, like I'm, I'm just picturing like you're, you're, like you go to bear pen and fly.

[01:38:01] So you hit bear pen and then you automatically go backwards and then go over fly to hawk it. Correct. Um, no, like then I retrace my steps, like down the road and then one up to Turk hollow. And it's dark as I'm going up to her, Cotto, Turk hollow, like the sun just set. And I was really dreading doing the bushwhack at night, like starting a bushwhack you've never done at night. It's not ideal, especially when the, no one really does.

[01:38:28] Um, so I just found where I thought I should go and just started walking straight into the woods on like the, uh, like following my, like the path I predetermined. And I also realized when I was halfway through, I was like, Oh, I kind of guessed these lines. Like I actually didn't think too much about it because I was going to recon the whole thing beforehand. And I didn't do that. So I, it took five hours and it shouldn't have, it was like four miles.

[01:38:55] I mean, like you're going once again from fly over to Hawkett. And this is an area that is not like, people don't see this often. Only people like Tad and you know, the dedicated people who want to like connect these two in a single day will do this. So you're going through unknown territory.

[01:39:20] But, but what I'm understanding what Alex did is after you do fly, you double back, you go down to route three and you head over to Durk Hollow road. And head east to the end of Durk Hollow road. And then you set off from Durk Hollow to do Hawkett. Is that generally correct? Yeah. Generally.

[01:39:43] Like if you follow like the trail that it leads into, like right when it like peaks or when it goes over the crest of the hill, that's when I started turning to do the bushwhack. Oh, okay. Okay. Sorry. Sorry. I misunderstood. Yeah. Why don't you just go from, from fly over towards sleeping lion. And then, um, I would cross private property. If I did that, you, you can drop down to the north east.

[01:40:07] You can drop down like 200 feet in vert and side and side hill on private land, uh, over towards the, there's a road that goes through that notch. There's actually a lean to there. Um, and then there's a couple dishwashers and yeah, that's why I, yeah. Yeah. And then, um, and then you can head over from sleep, uh, sleeping lion over to Hawkett. Although it, the crickers gets so thick in there. Yeah.

[01:40:37] Yeah. It's kind of like going through a car wash made of like, uh, switch plates. Yeah. So like I got to sleeping lion and I think that's when I had my closest call or is near there. I started, um, walking towards what I realized was a cliff. I got night is I was pretty tired. I just got really disoriented by like the ledge, like how, like the trees were protruding up. And it looked like it was solid ground. I got like five or 10 feet away and I realized I'm walking towards a ledge.

[01:41:06] Like that was the closest call I had honestly. Yeah. Yeah. And, and how much of that was solely because it was nighttime or you're just fucking tired and you're not making associations like you would if you were fully rested. Um, I think a lot of it was nighttime and just like how tired I was, but it also, it was kind of an illusion. Like it really did look like the ground was like solid where it wasn't where there's nothing.

[01:41:36] Yeah. And you were heading downhill at this point. Yeah. I, I kind of get off course too. Like those were reflective pieces of rope were really, really disorienting me for some reason. Did you ever figure out what they were from? I have no clue. I have no clue. I really want to know. Whoever did that made a lot of time on their hands. Yeah. That's pretty interesting. Yeah. Especially over on sleeping lion where nobody barely goes unless they want to do the cats go on their eyes.

[01:42:04] Yeah. There's no searches over there for a while. Like that I know of. Yeah. That's crazy. I've run in, I've run into some search lines out there. Um, between, uh, what was it? Big Indian and double top. There was that guy that was lost out there for like, I think a week or so. And I ran in three days, three, three days. Oh, I was out there for a week. So, all right. So, so Alex is heading towards Hawkett.

[01:42:33] He almost, uh, uh, Bush wax off a cliff in the middle of the night. Uh, he's, have you peed? We want to know. We like the listeners now are like following your story. Yeah. Everywhere. Oh, everywhere. She's, oh my God. He's marking his territory. No, it was fine. You have to be 150 feet off the trail when you relieve yourself. So I hope you didn't violate that rule. So you, you also let's, let's not forget that he entered South double top on this, right?

[01:43:01] Mm. Wow. So now you go to South, like just reversing back South double top on it. Wow. So now you're, you're up on, on. Hawkett. Like how, like it just took you so long to get on Hawkett. Why was that? Like, you're just disoriented. You, your navigation, like what was your navigation? Like, what did you use? Daya Strava. Like Strava heat maps are really useful because you can see every single, like you can see a lot. It's really good for bushwhacking.

[01:43:31] Not so much other stuff, but bushwhacks is it's solid. Like Strava, like my watch Garmin Phoenix and also like Garmin Explorer. I like that app as well. Okay. Nice. What Phoenix do you have? Phoenix seven. Solar. I just got the eight. So how is it?

[01:43:50] Uh, I don't like the navigation yet. I don't know. How do you, how do you follow yourself? Like, like when I did the map navigation, I would be on the map and then all of a sudden I would drift off the map. It doesn't follow me. Like it's weird. So anyway, anyway, let's let that get on that shit. All right. So Alex, Alex is making his way over to Hawkett. And what happens? Do you reach the summit of Hawkett? Oh yeah. Okay.

[01:44:15] I, I did after a really long time. And then I started descending after a little bit and then I told myself I deserve a nap and I also needed to charge my watch. So, um, I lay down to charge my watch and woke up like an hour and a half later. Where, where, where, where, where, you make it down to 42. No, not about like, I was about a half mile down the trail. I slept in a nettle field. Yeah. Right. It's basically what it is.

[01:44:43] So here's a question. If it's a hard path is, are you really sleeping within 150 feet of the trail? If it's not a marked trail. Well, that all depends if you're like, say that's a podcast. Yeah. If you're friendly with the podcast, it's okay. But if you never tag the show or support the show, then obviously you're violating rules. Okay. Correct. All right. So you, you, you're like a fun. Yeah. That settles it.

[01:45:08] Yeah. So let it be written that that's the rule. So you, you bed down in the nettle field. It is this like one o'clock, two o'clock in the morning, three o'clock in the morning. Like around, I think four or three around there. What was the weather conditions? Oh, they're nice. Okay. It was nice. So this is, what is this? Sunday now? Are we into Sunday? Sunday morning? Mm-hmm . Everything gets fuzzy. Okay.

[01:45:36] It was, was day two or three? I guess I can't remember. Like, but, um. Alex is struggling with this, but so here you are, you're heading down Hawket. You, you, you, you bed down for the night. 42 is not that far away. And when you go to sleep, do you think that you can finish?

[01:45:58] I think it's still possible. It's, it's a stretch, but honestly, the fact that I got as far as I did as a, that was, that was a stretch too. Uh, I wasn't expecting to go that far. And what do you have left to go? Um, just North Dome, Cheryl devil's path. And then Catterskill high peak around top and like the blackhead range. Or yeah. The escarpment, you know, the escarpment. Oh, it's not much.

[01:46:24] It's only like, let's say like, you have to still get over to, to round top and Catterskill. Yeah. Never happened. Yeah. So that's a really, really long way, but all right. So here you are, you get down to 42. How was it? You're going to go up to, uh, Cheryl. Uh, the shadow road. What's that shaft road? Okay. Yeah. Like it's pretty fast. I was worried to get hit by a car.

[01:46:53] Like every time I wanted to come towards me, I just step off the road completely. Yeah. Then I just take the herd path. That was pretty easy, honestly. And that was nice. Like the cliffs by like Cheryl or North Dome, those are something, but they weren't too bad. Yeah. Once you go down from North Dome down to the devil's path, it's this is one of the steepest, uh, kind of areas in the Catskills that unmarked, I would say. Yeah.

[01:47:20] Like, and also it's kind of a, I'm kind of uncertain, like how much of the ground is actually solid on these cliffs because like what's a hole, what's not. Like, I don't know. Oh yeah. So Danny Davis and I have had these discussions about the perception of solid ground on these slopes when it's really a talus slope with sometimes a thicker layer of forest cover, like broken branches, leaf litter and things like that.

[01:47:49] And other times a very thin cover. Yeah. So underneath that cover, you can have voids that are, you know, a couple feet to 10 feet. It all depends. Um, you know, how these rocks were put there at the time, but it's amazing that over the last. 10, 15, 20,000 years, those voids haven't filled in. And so literally you can be bushwhacking out there.

[01:48:14] You stop and you talk to somebody and you start sinking down because that what you thought was solid ground is just collapsing underneath you. So you get to shaft road, you start up Cheryl, you make it up Cheryl, right? You continue on to North dome. And then you, then you go down the steep area of devil, uh, somewhat what should be extension of devil's path. And then you hit devil's path. Now, what time of day did you go down North dome?

[01:48:43] Like, like you're hitting the steep area. Okay. That's not bad. So now you're hitting devil's path. What are your, like, you're like, what are your thoughts? Like I I'm hitting the shit of the shit. Oh yeah. I was pretty relieved honestly, to be on a Mark trail. Um, true, true. That was, that was nice. But then I started thinking, oh gosh, I don't have a ride at the end of this thing. Like I want someone to pick me up. Um, this is when this, this occurs to you. Like you're starting the devil's path. You're like, oh fuck.

[01:49:11] I might, I might actually get far enough that I need a ride back to my car. Pretty much. Well, I called six people beforehand and no one would agree to doing it except for smileys. He, like he, he pulled through, but, um, I just wanted someone. So I started without an actually secured ride and I was kind of stressed out about that, but it worked out. But I, once I got on the devil's path, I called my dad and I was like, Hey, like, can you help me? Like just secure right? Like, like I will cover it.

[01:49:39] But I ended up going with smileys anyway, but I was just freaking out about that. Yes. Let me tag that. That's smileys. Uh, taxis, right? Yeah. Yes. Okay. Okay. Now you hit devil's path. We're, we're talking stands peak, which is called what the fuck peak. Once again, like people that are traveling from east to west hit the what the fuck peak, how you're feeling good. You, you finally hit path. Uh, what do you feel when you're at like West kill?

[01:50:08] You're at the kind of like the tail end, the tail end of devil's path when you're coming east to west. But when you're going West teeth, that's kind of like you're at devil's path. We're fucking hitting the shit of the shit. Yeah. I was like, Oh, this isn't too bad. Um, it got progressively worse, but, um, it wasn't, yeah, I guess mostly just tired of being on technical terrain. Like after a long time, after a couple of days, I just don't want to be on rocks anymore.

[01:50:34] And I was, but, um, yeah, I was, I was still pumped. I started doing miles math for like, is this possible? Am I going to actually beat the record? And I did the math wrong. So I thought I was going to, so that was a good motivation too. Nice.

[01:50:50] Um, and then once again, like, uh, I, as I remember, I, you contacted me on Hawkett saying that you got, you had a rough night and, you know, I'm trying to keep like your, my, my, my, like, like con like confidence and stuff. And, you know, I'm like, you got this, let's go. And then you didn't contact me again till like Indian head. So now what is your experience going down? West kill up Southwest hunter stuff like that.

[01:51:17] I remember you saying you were hitting some rough weather. Oh gosh. Yeah. I was also trying to conserve batteries. I only have like 50% left in my phone. Like once going up, rust is really steep. But, um, once I forgot about rust, Jesus, I'm sorry. Yeah. I did rust. Um, that was steep, but like, that was a really nice bushwhack all the way over to hunter. Like I really, that was my favorite one. Honestly, this is really pretty. Um, going up hunters like nicely graded, nice spring also. So that's good.

[01:51:47] Once I got to Southwest hunter, that's when like the weather, like really started picking up. Like the trees, like seemed angry and like, it started raining sideways kinda. Hmm. And so I stopped at the shelter there, like the lean to there. Um, like for like 30 minutes and like put on leggings, which I knew I, I'm not going to find a dry spot for a long time. This is, this is it. I just nabbed for 10 minutes and then got going.

[01:52:12] Um, that descent from like that lean to all the way down to what like stony, like notch lake or whatnot that took forever. Um, it was so wet and all the rocks really slippery. I fell a few times and I was going like, once that happened, I knew like this record's not happening going like 40, doing 40 minute miles. This is nothing's going to happen, but you were, you were slowing down because of the slick conditions. Yeah.

[01:52:40] I also can't feel my ankles from my surgery, so it doesn't help. Jesus. Yeah. Well, that, that, that would be a concern. Okay. And in terms like this, you know, like back in, I don't know if I'd say 10 years ago before the, uh, the search and rescue podcast came along and that sounds like a search and rescue. I would say I would tag at sounds like a search and rescue is about to happen. No, definitely not.

[01:53:07] I mean, this is like, I mean, a lot of people underestimate devil's past, especially going down from like Hunter, like you're talking 2000 something of vert loss and it is rocky. It is scaly. It is an absolute bitch, especially once again, you're, you're, you're battling the elements like rain and shit like that. It sucks. So yeah, like I was really relying on my polls.

[01:53:35] So now you're, you were at the Southwest Hunter. Uh, what, what does that lean to called? Diamond, diamond, diamond, devil's acres. Yeah. Yeah. So now you said the weather started turning. What was like the temperature and stuff like that? Like, what are you hitting as a one weather? It was in the mid forties. Um, I checked the weather when I, uh, was going up plateau, like the wind chill was like in the low twenties.

[01:54:02] And by the time I was on plateau, it after a while, it actually starts snowing a little bit. So it was extremely cold. That was the most cold I've ever been like on in the caskills at least. Um, and I sheltered for about three hours on plateau, like in the only sheltered spot I could find. Wow. Where's that new? Um, like towards, as you're going up from like notch lake after like about a 10th of

[01:54:27] a mile on your left side is like a big rock wall that extends for like a hundred feet. And there's like a cave like in the, the hole in the, in the wall. And it was like right below that cave where I laid for a while. Wow. Unbelievable. And you encounter basically nobody on this. So you know, at that point, you can't ask for water. You can't ask for food. You can't near your unsupported. True. I wouldn't have done that.

[01:54:54] Like on West kill, actually, there was, um, a peanut butter, M and M that I just, it was on the ground and I got very upset that I couldn't eat it. Like, uh, that was a long, how long did you stare in that? It was like moral contemplation that there's nobody, there's nobody watching. There's this little peanut M and M. That's hardly like, you know, weighs a fraction of a fraction of an ounce.

[01:55:19] And you're like, am I going to break the rule or I'm going to be honest to the rule? I picked it up and I was like, I can't believe it. And then I, and then I dropped it up. Yeah. And then the five second rule came into play. No, no, no, no, definitely not. Well, there was also an IPA at the, uh, Shandikin lean to or nice. I didn't have it. Well, that's when I hallucinated though, that someone was staying in the lean to and I like disturbed their camp.

[01:55:47] It's like, I was convinced that there was a guy with red eyes, like by the porter by the, uh, the outhouse there when I first got there and I was like looking for him and he wasn't there of course, but I was convinced that I'd disturb someone. Cause did that guy look like this? Maybe. Okay. Crazy. All right. So you're, you, you cross over two 14, you're on plateau, you shelter on your way up plateau for, for how long?

[01:56:16] Like three hours. Wow. And so really cold. And when you, were you like able to get any rest or was this just to stay out of the weather? Um, I fell asleep for about an hour, but mostly to stay out of the weather. Like my sleep system, like it works when I'm sheltered and I can have like the mylar blanket over the synthetic quill. It works really well. And I was warm. But once I got out of that, I started running just to stay warm. I was really cold.

[01:56:45] I mean, luckily it was on plateau. Otherwise it's flat and you can jog and stuff. Okay. Yeah. So do you get to the other side, the Eastern side of plateau? Yeah. Honestly, after everything, after this is somewhat of a blur, I just was moving so slow. I was just trying not to fall the whole time. Wow. And like, is this because of, I mean, all of the, all the above, like sleep degradation,

[01:57:13] calorie degradation, the, the weather stuff like that. What, what is this? What is the top like concern that you have? Not concern. Like what happened the most that kind of like made you feel this way? It's just the rocks were so wet. I they're so mossy. Like, um, you just can't go fast. Like I, I'm not confident. I'm not going to risk anything. It's not worth it. Just some of the rocks are like a gamble. I slept on it. And like, I fall, I lose, I'll lose my balance and it's game over. I don't want to break anything.

[01:57:41] So just that I can always come back. Yeah. Plateau coming down that part of plateau is definitely one of those areas where you start, start to see a little bit of concern as you know, West kill West kill offers that a little bit, but not like the, the Eastern side of plateau. Yeah. Like going down, I was like, oh, this is what it's going to be like. Oh gosh. Because in my mind, I'm like, oh, if I just do like 20 minute miles, like I'm totally going to like get this record. And then I'm like, oh, maybe not going down plateau.

[01:58:11] But I saw someone going up was wearing micro spikes, which is crazy. Um, I said like, maybe you want to take them off, but to each their own. Wow. But micro spikes on Memorial day weekend. Yeah. Okay. All right. All right. I got to look at where I was on Memorial day weekend. All right. Yeah. Mike, I was, I was following you and you've, and you, you still went up your, you're still going up twin, uh, sugar loaf and then twin.

[01:58:41] Like, and you said, yeah, you're still, you're still going along, but then all of a sudden, like I, once again, I'm not following you minute by minute, but I all of a sudden see. Like, you're not doing anything and, and you finally send me a message saying like, here, I'm, I'm, I gotta go. Like, I can't finish this. Yeah. What happened? Like the weather, like everything, all of the above, like what was, what was going on?

[01:59:07] Well, so I, I actually ran into one of Mike Suti's friends, like Tom DeHaan on twin. And I told him what I was doing. We talked for a bit and he's cool guy. Um, he's like, oh yeah, you have like 35 miles left. And I was like, wait, what? 35 miles. If I had like, I was twin. 20, 20 miles away. And I'm, you know, once after that conversation, it sank in that this is not happening and I had to get to work on Monday and I'm not going to make it for my ride. If I don't call it here, I get Indian head.

[01:59:36] So I ultimately did. And, um, So after this, you were going to go to work the next day. That was the plan. Yeah. I ended up taking a sick day and going to the doctor instead of my throat, of my throat infection. My throat infection. Are you God bless America. This is all I got to say. God bless. We do the God damn catskill attempt at the catskill diartissima, but then we have to go to the work the next day. Wow. Silence.

[02:00:06] So Alex, what was, what was the darkest moment in this journey? The shandaken lean to after that? Where, where was it that you were like in the worst spot on this? Yeah. Um, definitely the hawk at bushwhack. I like almost lost it. I came to the point where I was like, imagine what I'm going to do if I see a bear. And I thought like boxing, the bear was like the best course of action. I thought I could take it.

[02:00:32] So like, that was, I was really, really angry, honestly, getting going through all like the thorn bushes. This is constantly getting cut up. Yeah. But other than that, it was lying on the ground on big Indian. I called my mom saying like, I'm not, I never want to hike again. Like I'm done. And she said, you say that every time. And then I was like, okay, that's true. That is correct. Every mother knows their kids also well. Right. Yeah. So there's your mom coming through for you.

[02:00:59] I was gonna say like, like usually your mom's kind of try to talk you out of that, but she's like, probably like, don't be a pussy. You can do this. Yeah. She didn't say it like that, but I think that's what she meant. Yeah. That's why Stosh is not a mom. Correct. Just putting, just putting that out there. Listen, is your, is your traversing. Going across the devil's path, making your way to Indian hedge. You still think that you can beat the record until you run into Tom DeHaan. Yeah.

[02:01:26] Who recalibrates your math and you realize that you have how many more miles to go than you were expecting. But like 15 or like 10 more than I thought. Mm-hmm. That would, that if you're averaging a half a mile or averaging a mile, a half an hour, that's like, you know, seven, eight hours. Yeah. Was it not being able to finish to get to work the next day was the deal breaker?

[02:01:55] Or was it you're just fucking fatigued? That's fair. It was a combination of all of it. Mostly, I don't see the point of going on in the effort if I'm not going to actually beat the record. So that math was automatically just bad once I found that out. Also, I was going to miss my ride. And I was going to finish at 3 a.m. or 2 a.m. I was like, hmm, don't know about that. Yeah, that's going to be hard to get it right.

[02:02:21] So is it fair to say that when you got that information, it just kind of took the wind out of your sails? Oh, yeah. Like a minute after when I realized what he said, I was like so out of it. I kind of forgot his name until Mike emailed me a few days ago. Okay. So he hears you this. And is it like on the spot you decide to bail or do you continue on? And over the next 5, 10, 15, 20 minutes, you're like, uh, this, you know, the whole why.

[02:02:50] And purpose and whatever just leaves you. And you're like going to throw in the towel for this time. How did, how did that thought process unwind? I'm just mostly like being that took me like 45 minutes to do one mile. Just that alone after a mile. I was like, okay, this is taking forever. I'm going to be out here all day. Um, it just didn't make sense anymore. Like I, I came and did what I wanted to do. I did a good recon for next year.

[02:03:18] I did a, I got a lot of the peaks done that I had never done before and I was pretty happy with myself and I was ready to go. Nice. So how, how did you get off of Indian head? Where did you go? Um, oh yeah, yeah. Sorry. I met Tim at Platte Cove road, but I got lost somehow coming off Indian head. I ended up adding like a couple of miles to my, I went one way, then I backtracked and

[02:03:45] then went the other way, did a loop and met up at, um, near the Platte Cove falls. Okay. Okay. So you probably went back on devil's path and went to, uh, uh, was it, uh, goddamn. What was that go like? Uh, no, no, no, no. What was that go like? No, the other way, uh, to the start of devil's path, predator road? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I mean, uh, that's, that's, that's, that's the actual start and finish of the, the, uh,

[02:04:15] the Indian head or the, the devil's path. So understandable. Understandable. Yeah. So you, you told us Alex about the, the weird, somewhat hallucinogenic experiences you were having in the Shandaken lean to, um, that you were envisioned yourself boxing a bear going up pocket. Did you have these thoughts elsewhere? Were you like in a hallucinogenic zone for hours or did you have periods where you just

[02:04:42] went back and forth transition to, you know, being more present and coherent to. Just having like weird and wild things going through your head. Um, I'd say like the whole mostly like at night, that's when I had a lot of illusions, but, um, mostly like in my peripheral vision, uh, like my glasses would reflect in my waist lamp and it always looked like there were like eyes, like kind of like coming at me, like looking at me.

[02:05:12] And that was really like trippy, honestly. But once I realized that that's what was going on, I still, I would still get scared every minute, but I just didn't freak myself out. And like, if you don't look behind you, like nothing's following. So, so, so how long did it take you to make that association that it was the light reflecting off your glasses versus the reality that two days, he said, did I get that right? You squeaked in there two days, two days as he looks away from his microphone. Okay. Nice.

[02:05:38] Um, so you, you finish this up, you, you're in the car taking the ride back to your car. When does like the, the pain, the stiffness, the soreness really like fully ratchet up on you? Is it like right away the next day? Um, I would say no, I actually like had trouble sleeping. I was just so like kind of wired from doing what I did that it's like so tired.

[02:06:07] I couldn't sleep. It felt, it felt really odd. Yeah. I also didn't feel very good either. My throat really hurt. Yeah. Did you drive home? You hopped in your car and you drove back to Boston? Um, I like slept in my car and like, well, I did not sleep in my car in the parking lot. Um, where I parked, um, for like a few hours. And then I went to like my motel and went to sleep and overslept my checkout and then drove home. No shit. Yeah.

[02:06:37] Where did, what did you say that? Did they, I mean, did they accept like, be like, oh, well, you're a badass. So we'll accept that. I was like 30 minutes past it. She didn't, it wasn't bad, but I will still look up in a panic. Like, oh gosh, here we go again. Nice. That was good. So what did you, what did other than the doctors, what did you do for recovery? Just sleep, sleep, sleep and eat. I lost about seven pounds. Wow. Yeah. That's about right.

[02:07:07] And water fricking calories. Yeah. It's all on water. It's just, we'll, we'll carry out. Like I, I seriously don't know how you have enough energy to even do some of this with just, you know, watering and calories and stuff like that. That's just insane. Yeah. It comes to, I think it's mostly as wanting to do it. After a point, just not wanting to stop. Why is it you want to do this? Put yourself through this. It's a good question.

[02:07:33] Why not just walk out into traffic and get hit by a bus and then sue the busing company and make millions. Yeah. Can't make millions. Maybe after the, after I get the, the unsupported FKT, but like before I'd say, so like when I was 20, I had cancer. I think that kind of. I gotcha. Reframed a lot of my outlook on life and what I like things I like. And now that I'm past that, it's kind of, um, Oh, I like to use my body to the best of its

[02:08:03] ability. Yeah. But this is this whole experience then boils down to, it's like a reaffirmation of your existence. You're going out, you're trying to beat the odds or giving it your all. And whether you finish the effort or you make it 80% of the way, you can look around and say, Hey man, I'm still alive. I'm still out there doing this shit and putting myself through it on my terms. Totally. Yeah. I did that. Yeah.

[02:08:30] I had a, of all things, I had a really bad bicycle racing accident in my lifetime. And after that, that was my, like my mantra was, you know, I'm not taking it easy. I'm going to get out there and do what I want to do and have fun, you know? Um, so I totally dig that. So, but you're, and so you are planning in 2027 to do your third attempt at beating Mike

[02:09:00] Sudi's record. Right. Okay. I'm not going after Mike Sudi's record. Like two days, nine hours. Can't do that. I think it could go sub three unsupported. I have to do, I'm beating Corey Delvall and Jan Welford's four days, 13 hours. So 2027, I think that's going to happen. Um, so what are you changing this time? What's what's what are you? One is training. Okay. That might help. That might help. I also have one question.

[02:09:27] Like after this attempt, have you kind of developed a different respect of the Catskills? Oh, totally. Okay. Well, like the first attempt, I, I got hurt. So like, I, I respected them right after that, but doing the devil's path, honestly, like I'd never done it before and doing it after what? Like 90 miles or something. It was not, but it, it, it was nice. Honestly, like, I think I'm going to go do the devil path, devil's path first.

[02:09:57] This time we changed the change the direction, but, uh, castles are hard. They're hard. Also the rocks are much slippery, more slippery when wet and in the whites. Um, it's just what they tell me. Yeah. Yeah. I, I agree. I agree. You know, bedding the whites and, and stuff like that. It feels like they're, uh, it's not limestone, but if I think it's limestone, it's just more grippier. And I'm just like, wow, this is, this is pretty easy to go up this when the catskills. It's like, you're done. Totally.

[02:10:25] Or like the casticles, like there are fewer people like depending on where you go, like usually, and it's nice. You can, I was alone for most of it. I want until the devil's bath. So that was cool too. Is that good or bad? Oh, it's good. You're going to do at the same time of year. I would do like earlier may. Wow. Like a few weeks earlier. Why, why not in the fall? I may reattempt in the fall as well, but that's not optimal because there's less daylight.

[02:10:52] But, um, I think I can give this a good shot in the fall also just cause, because like, I want to do the 35 in the fall and then do the 33, like Matt's record. Do that in May. Ideally. Wow. So we're going to have to like catch you on trail. Hey, you're at the Shandake and Lucho. Are you seeing anything in your mind? Like, what are you seeing right now? And he's just like, Oh, fucking bears attacking me. Yeah.

[02:11:18] We'll show up with our beady red eyes and devil's IPA masks on. Right. And we'll make strange noises. We won't be on the podcast. We'll be off trail and just be like staring at you like mountain lions. Be like, what's that? And we'll be recording the whole fricking time. We'll be recording this. So do you do other, uh, FKTs?

[02:11:42] Um, I've tried a lot, but, um, I discovered I had a compartment syndrome last year when I tried several FKTs and that's not conducive to going fast because after about like 12 hours, my calves wouldn't really work very well. And I would have to like pull myself with trekking poles. Wow. Yeah. So yeah. Yeah. I tried like the Benton McKay trail. Like I know Chris LeBlanc. He also did that. And I also tried the long path and that's when I realized I needed surgery. So. Oh, wow. Wow.

[02:12:12] So crazy. Yeah. So after the surgery, did you get a good result? Yeah. I took like four months though for me to know it worked. Like I spent like a lot of this past year, like being unsure if I'd be able to walk well again. So that was kind of scary, but it worked and I can do stuff like this. So I'm happy. What about cycling? You think about getting back into cycling now? Maybe I'm an indoor trainer, but I got hit by a car when I was younger and it's like, Oh, Oh. Runes takes the fun out of it. Yeah.

[02:12:42] I totally understand that. Yeah. That's a little extreme. Like, I mean, I, I, I don't know if like we have anything more to go on. Like, it's just like. Yeah. What do you, what else do you, you want to throw out there that we didn't hit you with already? Um, I would say like you had to have Matt Mata on like his records. Awesome. Like he took a day off, uh, Corey and Yon's well, uh, record.

[02:13:08] And I also think that, um, I think we covered a lot. I think we covered it all. Where do you, where can I get this stuff on Matt Mata and like Strava? Yeah. I can send you his stuff after this. Yeah. Yeah. Let's just shout out his cell phone number right now. WhatsApp. I mean, that's cool. Like I would just like, yeah, I'd like to know about that. Cause I had no clue about that. It was just crazy. Yeah. And like, like once again, like I, I, when you, you sent me the message of you doing this,

[02:13:37] I was like, what the fuck? This guy's a psycho. So, and then like continuously sending me messages of being like, Hey, I'm here. Hey, I'm here. And then I'm just like, all right, that, that took you a while. And then he, you sending me like a message, like, Hey, I have, I hit some crazy conditions. I got a bail. I'm like, number one, like I was, I wouldn't say I was disappointed, but you know, I was like, Oh, I was looking forward to this.

[02:14:04] But then there's a level of respect of you being like, you know, this is not going to be possible. I gotta end this before I like do something myself when, and, you know, this will be a search and rescue, you know, and there's just so much respect in that of, of just somebody, you know, calling it quits when, you know, it's, I have, I have very, very good. Once again, level of respect for people that do that, you know, like,

[02:14:33] you know, call it quits when they, they know something is not right when they're feeling, you know, that. And I, I really appreciate it. And I appreciate you coming on the show and talking about that. Cause you know, once again, it takes a lot of courage, you know, to talk about that. You know, a lot of people talk about, you know, I finished this, I did this woohoo. But then saying like, I almost finished this is not really, you know, top of the peak stuff. Yeah, totally.

[02:14:59] Totally. And like, I self rescued from self double top with a dislocated shoulder last year. And so that was humbling. And I actually called like the Rangers. I'm like, Hey, like this is what happened. And, but they wouldn't tell me how to put my shoulder back in. I was like, you know what? I don't want, I feel bad having people come out and help me for an arm injury that I can walk out with. So what'd you say? Fuck you. I'll do this myself. I couldn't believe it. I was expecting like medical advice. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Where did it happen? Where'd you dislocate the shoulder?

[02:15:30] Right on the ledges of self double top when you're going like just starting to go up from big Indian. Okay. Like my shoulder, I didn't fall off on the ground. Like I kind of fell forward with my arm up and then it snapped out of place. Yeah. Was it painful? It was. Yeah. I almost passed out from the pain. It was the most pain I've ever had. Like, but it was out for a day and a half. Not at all. I spent the night under a rock. Yeah.

[02:15:58] And did they, the Rangers come out and pick you up or did you walk out? I walked out. It took me nine hours to get to Frost Valley. Wow. They're very nice. Yeah. Yeah. So, so let me ask you, you have this, you have this incident, you dislocate your shoulder, you're approaching double top or self double top. Having that in mind, do you think that in your first aid kit, you should be able to carry a narcotic? Oh, totally. Yeah.

[02:16:27] Like I actually, I wish I, I would have been really helpful to have like an, a pain, a painkiller. Or two. Yeah. Or two or maybe three. Like I was, it was an overwhelming amount of pain to be in for that long. Honestly. Yeah. Yeah. It's not that I know about. Yeah. It's not that I have any firsthand knowledge about shoulder injuries while hiking. True. True. Yeah.

[02:16:52] So to wrap this up, Alex, uh, on the way out or, you know, at the time, did you get any like post hike bruising bites that you want to mention out? Like besides passing out in the tax, trying to pass out in the taxi cab. Did you get anything on your way home that you want to mention for the Catskills for your post hike? Uh, I just got pancakes at the Phoenicia diner or whatever. Those are good. Yeah. Other than that.

[02:17:18] You could have gotten pancakes anywhere and they would have been good. Okay. That's true. If you're going to get pancakes, that's a good place to go get them. I mean, you could have gotten them at McDonald's or it, you know, Jiffy Lube auto changes and pancake house and they would have been good after that. So, that's true, true. So, uh, wrapping this up. Thanks, uh, Alex, for joining us on the show.

[02:17:44] It was really awesome to hear about the attempt, about your, your effort going through the 35 peaks and, and a couple of days. It's just phenomenal to hear about that and to hear about every, each part, uh, that you encountered. Uh, I really appreciate it. And, uh, once again, you know, keep in touch. Let's let's, we, we can't wait to hear about, you know, your next attempt. And how it goes. Appreciate it. I really appreciate you guys having me on.

[02:18:10] I'd like to give a special thanks to Mike Sudi, Matt Mata and Steven Messer. You guys, uh, really supported me when I was doing this and thank you. Definitely. Mike actually listens to the show, which is, which is awesome. He actually calls me out on a lot of the, a lot of stuff, which I love. I love, I love. Yeah. So Alex, thank you for once again, for joining us. Really appreciate it. Hope you have a good night. I, I once again, want to give a big shout out to the monthly supporters and the monthly sponsors. You really keep this show going.

[02:18:40] And I want a big shout out to Alex for joining us because he took his time out to tell us about his huge experience that he had doing the diartism on the Catskills. Yeah. Yeah. So have a good night guys. See you later.

[02:19:23] Hi everyone. The Catskills. You gotta just keep on living in the Catskills, man. L-I-V-I-N Wicked, wicked, wicked, wicked.